Last year, in the face of the new legislation relating to child abuse, I went out and bought a coffee-table-sized wooden book on child psychology. And what a joy it’s been — every time the kids give me crap, I hit them with it.
I mean, what are parents supposed to do? You can’t touch ‘em, the teachers lecture by walkie-talkie while wearing bulletproof vests and the army’s no longer compulsory. So where are they going to learn about discipline?
My suggestion that we have them all spayed has been rejected out of hand — I got a letter from the human rights geniuses along the lines of “Dear sir, blah blah blah, wipe out the species, yadda yadda yadda, have you been assessed by any mental health specialists lately?”
Yet if we have regard to just a few of the latest stories in the world’s press, then all humour goes out the window. The system is failing the children and the product thereof is failing the system.
The Sowetan says South African schools are among the worst in Africa.
The Times of London has coverage on the child from a school in southern Finland who went beserk and massacred his headmistress and fellow pupils, and a photo gallery of the Virginia Tech massacre.
Topix has the story breaking in the US of a teacher from Nebraska who ran away with her 13-year-old pupil.
And the Scotsman and the Mail & Guardian Online have items on the disaster at Oprah’s school.
This is scratching a vast surface of tales about child abuse and violence and mayhem, which are becoming more and more frequent in schools around the world.
What happened at Oprah’s school, if it turns out to be true, is tragic. Child molestation and, as we saw above in Nebraska, abduction posing as a fling, are wholly unacceptable. But lest we forget, society has any number of weapons and safeguards to deal with this type of outrage.
Tough laws, registers of offenders, newspapers and other forms of media wait for schools where there is even a hint of this type of behaviour. The list is endless.
But as the laws on adults and teachers who fail to safeguard or infringe on the rights of children become tougher by the day, the laws regulating the behaviour of the children get slacker by the hour.
We have just recovered from the murder of a King Edward Secondary School pupil who was allegedly killed by pupils from a rival school.
According to a recent British survey, the age of criminals involved in violent crime is getting lower by the year. Reports of pupils carrying knives and guns are flooding the media.
Yet each year authorities seek out new and better ways to “safeguard” the rights of children and provide them with a more secure environment.
Unfortunately, while removing anything resembling tough sanctions by parents and teachers, they forget to explain how we are supposed to teach litte Johnny Untouchable that just as he has rights, he also has obligations to respect the rights of others.
Security and caring is shown by setting out and enforcing strict parameters within which children grow up; not by trying to be their pals or excusing disgusting behaviour.
The knock-on effect of allowing kids to run rampant in case we stunt their growth or creativity is breeding a generation of insecure monsters. When released from school they become aimless and aggressive in the face of an uncaring society with parents conditioned to allow them to do what they want.
What children want is for you to give a damn; not to shunt them off to malls for teenage sex or drugs so you can do whatever it is you do at the weekend.
People complain about bullying and children who turn to drugs and become unmanageable yet all the while removing the fear of any meaningful reprisal from those in a position of authority.
The longer the trend towards absolute rights with almost non-existent duties and obligations to respect the rights of others goes on, the more these headlines will dominate. These children become young adults and over and over again demonstrate a complete disregard for the rights of others. This is manifesting itself in the form of violent crime and massacres of the kind we witnessed at Jokela.
How can we expect children to respect others when each day they are being taught about their rights and freedoms? That anyone who dares come near them or shouts at them will be punished? What do you expect, then, when they later learn that while everyone is obssessed with their own rights, nobody gives a damn about anyone elses?
When the Virginia Tech and Jokela murderers massacred their fellow students, did they see the victims as people or merely as the bastards who dared to infringe on their rights? Explode the myth that they are protected by the state within this cocoon of rights.
Because if everyone has rights and nobody has a duty to respect those rights, nobody has any rights at all. So law is in the eye of the gun holder.
It’s like a car manufacturer getting rid of all quality safeguards and then throwing its hands up because all its vehicles keep breaking down.
It’s time to accept that the power of parents to discipline their children has to be reinstated — and teachers need to be allowed to cane those children who get out of hand. Reinstate national service and let the young men learn discipline while assisting the police in fighting crime.
If we carry on like this, the incidents are just going to increase in frequency — and for the state to then look to parents for answers on their children’s conduct is not only unfair, it’s actually absurd.
I’ll get me coat.
“… if everyone has rights and nobody has a duty to respect those rights, nobody has any rights at all.”
Nicely said Trapido.
My sense is that children are being taught that they have a right to unfettered happiness, so that when life deals them a bad hand, they’re entitled to be bitter and resentful.
We’re encouraging the creation of generations of children that are increasingly incapable of dealing with adolescent angst, because they are not used to being denied their wishes or having their freedom curbed.
Thank God! An opinion that I can wholeheartedly agree with!I was brought up within quite strict boundaries and while disliking it at the time(naturally) I appreciate my parents efforts today. National service(notwithstanding all the apartheid-era political connotations) for me was a key time in my life. I hated it, but I grew emotionally ten years in the two years I served. “Spare the rod spoil the child”.
Dear Mike
I do believe parents the to take responsibility for the upbringing of their children. This may mean saying no, no again and again, and more importantly, living with the consequences of saying no, like being unpopular with them and their friends spending time with them while they are grounded, ganging up with like minded parents for surveillance purposes, and knowing where they are at night, in the middle of a Saturday afternoon,and who their friends are. Love is really about paying attention, paying attention to homework, turning off television, teaching boys and girls to cook, clean up, and in terms of schooling, supporting their teachers and rugby/hockey/netball/drama/soccer coaches, or reporting abusive ones. Going to parent evenings and meeting fellow parents, knowing you are not alone.
I taught large classes for a number of years and as a woman I wasn’t allowed to cane anybody. I never wanted or needed to. I have seen terrible physical violence in schools, a response of unprepared or underprepared teachers to children who are effectively parentless, and imitate American sitcoms, hip-hop and car advertisements with screaming tyres and macho drivers.( These are the ones in Sandton and Soweto, or at a party in Randburg) The idea of reinstating caning is abhorrent in a society where violence is the norm. It takes a great deal more strength and guts to develop a relationship of love and firmness with kids and teenagers than it does to hit them.And it’s okay to yell at them and have a temper tantrum once in a while, as a parent. They need to know you are human and have your limits. Children need consistently imposed boundaries, very firmly and lovingly imposed. Tiring stuff, it’s a lifetime commitment. To quote Crosby, Stills and Nash, ‘ And you know they’ll love you’
Sue
Dear Mr Michael Trapido
Do you not feel that its not time that all the authorities(parents,teachers,education dept,religious leaders etc) should impose a compulsory religious programmee with checks and balances into all school learners curriculum for all denomonations in order that our future generational leaders have a well etched value based system based on spirituality,love,respect,purity,contentment,discipline and the protection of all. I feel that we celebrate so many other days at educational institutions and in our nation eg water day,green heritage day etc but what about GOOD MANNERS DAY and an organization called THE South African Good Manners Society with schools, parents, citizens ,ngo’s , co operations etc being members and sponsors setting out a charter, code of conduct competitions etc and hoorah what a wonderful country we shall have? Come on bloggers lets talk about more positive solutions not just problems
Good subject. I would like to commend just with few words. the first thing that is happening in our society is that some of older people do not respect a child so that the child can learn and bring back the respect to the older. it is wrong for our legislature to let children have over much of the rights, some of the elders do stupid things just to spyed over this right. I am one of the people whom is agianst this children rights because when you are a parent, you have the right to bring your child to order. No one was there and help you with your partner on the decision of bringing this child to life and then after the child is here, then there are rules on how to build up you child. which is wrong. It takes two people to create this gift. so why other people come and tell you on how to water you plants and gives regulations and laws over your plants.
I will like to ask the person who implemented this law how is he/she is feeling about his/her old days of growing up. He/she had a good relationship with the parents and teachers, He/she is like this today because of descipline so as this children does need descipline. where are we going with the children whom do not know descipline, what kind of leaders would they be after we died because we taught them how to object when elders put descipline to them. what kind of nation are we building to let the children have an abortion. It is really disgusting to see that we do not have good legislatures planners. I believe that they did not plan this and just implemented it by not knowing what are the results.
I am glad that I still descipline my child to the limit whereby I do not abuse him, but show him the good puth of life and he should also do that to his child. There are people who abuse children through many things and those people are the one’s who need special attention. I am who I am because of desciline especially at school. Teachers are the one’s who sharpens the children better than their parents, it is because they spend a lot of time with this children.
Lastly I would say the black nation got lost when they started to put this law in place of action.Now the children swears their parents and the parents now does descipline through emotional preassure. They ended up killing their own kids because they believe they cannot bring this children to life and then after they tend to become their monsters, they tend to become their parents’s God. This nation is going to burn and the fire is still burning. God bless those who descipline their children and shows them the right path of living. Do not create a monster. give your children love and respect then they will return that by rewarding your through respecting every person/ living beings.
Michael Trapido writes: “It’s time to accept that the power of parents to discipline their children has to be reinstated — and teachers need to be allowed to cane those children who get out of hand. Reinstate national service and let the young men learn discipline while assisting the police in fighting crime.”
I am an Finn, and I find it most disturbing to read something like this. I understand that these are opinions of the writer, but I find it quite appalling to read something like this, especially from a South African Newspaper site. South Africa is a country widely respected (at least in Finland) for the peaceful process after the apartheid era. From a Finnish point of view the above quotation seems even more alarming – the solution to violence is more violence! I hope this does not represent the majority perspective in RSA towards violence. It has been tried out, and we all know what came out of it. The problem of individuals acting violently can not be solved by the society acting violently.
Trapido’s opinions are, horrifyingly, very similar to those of the Jokela shooter. I hope there isn’t a school nearby…
Nicely said BUT surely bad child behaviour has more to do with parents and teachers who don’t care. It is far easier for a parent to leave the child by the TV / PC than entertain / play with them.
The problem really stems from the small family unit where the children are spoilt and the parents both work and don’t have time to be a parent.
A PC game allows one to kill people with no consequences.
Porn and bad behaviour is shown on TV.
Anything goes with cell phones.
1 year National service in the police and health sectors would be very beneficial. Young people should learn to give back to their communities.
Some other points:
The food we eat is not healthy and creates havoc with childrens behaviour and energy levels. All the growth hormons in food must also contribute to larger kids.
I raised 2 kids and only used corporal punishment once. Yet I have friends who had kids that just did not behave despite many hidings. Sometimes it is in the genes. Each person / child is different.
With so much TV and internet access we now hear about all the stories. Bad kids / people have always existed. How different are we to say the slave trading era?
Let’s carefully consider this little multiple choice test:
1. The first world war, the second world war, the gulf war, and the horrific violent crime in SA, are and were all perpertrated by
a) Generations who were physically ‘disciplined’in the exact way you are recommending as ideal for creating harmony in our world
b) Generations who were disciplined exclusively with reason and non-violent punishment.
Children who have been ONLY discliplined with reason and non-violent punishment ALL of their lives are
1) Currently the majority
b) Currently the minority
c) Currently mostly over 15years of age
d) Currently mostly under 15 years of age.
So what are you basing your ‘observations’ on?
I’d put it to you that you are the proof of the pudding: raised with violence you wholewheartedly believe that violence is the ideal way. You find it impossible to even imagine anything else being effective. Yet, I challenge you to do some actual research rather than blind opinioneering, and go check out the backgrounds of the most violent kids in any classroom. I’m willing to bet my coat, hat and gloves that every one of them has had the spanking you think they ‘need’, and that that is a major part of the problem.
Everyone keeps whining that ‘there are no alternatives offered to parents’. Yet the truth is, people don’t want to know about the alternatives, because they are challenging, they take actual effort. They also require the emotional intelligence that we graduated spankees never got to develop and battle to develop even now.
Aletha Solter, Phd, has been providing real alternatives that actually work, for more than two decades. She is actively involved in EFFECTIVELY rehabilitating violent juvenile offenders in a way that nothing else, certainly not punishment can match. But have you ever heard of her? Have you ever considered her methods when raising your kids? No, probably not. Because she’s just plain not popular. Go google her and figure out why.
We could write a thesis on the subject of discipline and children. Owen is right about one thing – different things work for different children. But I really take umbrage when the responsibility is put on teachers’ shoulders. Yes, a lot of teachers don’t care. But why? Because they are abused by the system,the parents and the children. And the bottom line is that discipline starts in the HOME. You cannot expect the children to be disciplined at school when the parents don’t follow through and allow the children to do exactly as they please. My husband is a teacher at a very expensive private school and the things that happen on a daily basis would turn your hair white within an hour. And I’m not even talking about the kids. The parents are in a league all of their own. Please, we need to get back to basics. Children HAVE to learn that they are not the be and all of their small world. And parents need to be parents, the role models, to set an example. They are not their children’s buddies – they are parents, adults and should act like it. Unfortunately we do live in a world where young people are exposed to far more than they are ready for by way of the media, internet and tv. Parents need to spend more time with their children particularly for this reason. If they don’t children and young people will take what they see around them as their guide. At the end of it all parents will one day stand accountable before God the Father and have to explain what they did with the precious gifts He gave them to look after, nurture and cherish for Him. Just think about that!
It is hard to hear parents spoil their children and if there are parents who are like that, so they must adopt the life style of white people by not letting their kids of the yard and play with other kids. they must keep their kids in the yrds because they are spoilt and they corrupt other kids. that is why you get the white kids playing alone in the house without a friend, is because the parents bought him/her evrything that she/he can play with and everything to eat.
It is hard to compare our life style with the richest because you want to certiesfy your kids by the way you earn, I am sticking to one point. lets teach our children respect, loyalty and education. We need also to teach them not to be imvolved with corrupt kids. Those who have everything in their places, they conquer this kids just because they know that they will be rescued by their parents who got money to clean up their mess.
It is a high time this law changes, when a child commit a crime, she/he must be punished according to what he/she has done. We will see descipline come back itself to this kids.
The truth is we need those laws against hitting kids because there are both teachers and parents who use discipline as an excuse to vent their own frustrations. It is also ridiculous to expect the onus to be on the teachers simply because they spend more time with the kids. They also have a much larger group of children to deal with than most of us have in our family. A teacher’s job must be just about impossible if the children have not been taught discipline at home. But using the rod or even the bare hand will never teach a child discipline – the only way children learn properly is by example. If you want your children to be disciplined then you must be disciplined – when you really feel like relaxing with a drink in front of the TV remember the child that needs your input to finish their homework – put the kids first – that does not mean spoiling them – it means sacrificing what you want to do in order to follow them up – is your homework done – are your shoes polished – did you clean your room – is your uniform on a hanger – dead boring sure but far more effective than ignoring their behaviour until it becomes an imposition and then lashing out with the rod or the belt or whatever. I believe in being a friend to my kids – I do not believe in the aloof authoritarian mode of parenting. Maybe it is something to do with being an all girl family. I am a single mother with 4 daughters and people are sometimes amazed at how close we are. My adolescent daughter tells me everything – sometimes only a couple of weeks later but I always hear about it. You always hear people saying – you must talk to your kids about sex or someone else will. Sometimes that’s all we ever talk about. I think the most important thing in parenting is to cultivate mutual love and respect and by being disciplined in yourself your kids will naturally follow you
Let’s just get totally, utterly clear. Let’s look past your clever word plays and flippant style.
Are you, a man of apparent intelligence and life experience, seriously suggesting that a child so emotionally disturbed that they can actually murder a classmate, could be cured with six of the best?
And is a reputable newspaper giving you the space to do so, and even calling you a ‘thoughtleader’?
That, for me, is certainly a symptom of something more serious.
Je’anna I am not suggesting that a seriously disturbed individual can be “cured” by corporal punishment.
That would be punishing a victim.
I am suggesting that our children are far more violent and insecure since their boundaries have been blurred and any form of physical sanction removed.
They no longer respect parents, teachers, their elders or anyone in authority. I base this on my experience as a criminal attorney and not on any reading of statistics.
The stastics on children committing violent crimes are becoming staggering. Not only with regard to the frequency but also the nature of the brutality.
Regarding your reference to wars, I think you will find that there are more wars today than there have ever been. The Gulf War, however, belongs to this generation.
The difference is that people returning from a World War I or World War II found a society with some form of structure and order.
They weren’t confronted by armed children wearing hoods who are ever increasingly committing violent crimes.
Je’anna’s blog :
http://lotsareviews.co.za
Thing is, Michael, Ben Johnson, Medieval poet and playwright, hundreds of years ago was entertaining people by pointing out that the youth ‘no longer’ respected their elders. Caning and corporal punishment have been around for millennia, but have not changed this basic human intergenerational experience. So to some extent, we have to accept it as a fact of nature. The question is how far it’s going to go and what we are going to do about it.
When you have a platform to speak from, you can choose to be entertaining and go for the easy laughs, or you can choose to attempt a different kind of impact. Problem is, nobody wants to listen unless you entertain them. I know, from my own experience, it’s not easy to get a good balance. I think something you and I have in common is that we try. It is in acknowledgement of that, that I take the time to write what I do below.
I accept that your experience as a criminal attorney gives you a certain way of seeing things.
I have a bit of research experience, so I look at this argument with that kind of eye.
And I can’t help wondering what child psychology book you bought, and whether it was research-based or one of the pseudo-scientific exercises in opinioneering that are becoming horribly more prolific with each decade. You unfortunately don’t seem to have been armed with, for e.g. an understanding of the neurochemistry of stress, and the deleterious impact of corporal punishment on the vulnerable developing brain.
You see children damaged by our current way of life, and you see hideous crimes. I agree. I see that too. And yes, I’m sure you get to see it in technicolour and close-up and that makes you passionate about trying to do something about it. But the assumption that you make about the causal process involved needs more rigorous investigation. Let’s look at your logic, as I understand it – “1) Children need boundaries, 2) Children without sufficient boundaries can exhibit problem behaviour, 3) If we assume that corporal punishment is what is needed for children to establish boundaries, 4) Then it could be said that problem behaviour is due to a lack of corporal punishment.”
Fair enough, you are a litigator, not a researcher. But what is common to both research and litigation is the question of the validity of evidence. So, on what evidence do you base your assumptions? 1) Children need boundaries – yes, I agree, we have evidence for that. 2) Ditto 3) If we assume… – This is a mighty important ‘IF’. Here’s where you need to provide your evidence, because I’ve never come across any, ever, at all. Just the opposite.
There is certainly a very strong cultural superstition supporting the assumption that corporal punishment is useful, even necessary for effective discipline. Like I said, those raised with violence believe in it just the same way that those raised to dance a jig to make the sun come up every morning will swear by the efficacy of that practise too. But when we come to actually investigate this issue?
From all I have seen and read, punitive parenting and permissive, laissez-faire parenting are equally problematic. But firm, clear, consistent non-punitive parenting yields some truly wonderful results in terms of giving children a chance to become truly responsible and self-regulated, and to develop genuine empathy and compassion rather than merely the cowed and tenuous compliance that corporal punishment is ideal for creating.
Families that offer love and consistency and stability can ‘get away with’ using corporal punishment because they are offering enough of what children really need in order to establish boundaries, and I suspect that this might be the kind of family you are thinking of. It is a dangerous leap to assume that it was the corporal punishment rather than the other good stuff that did the trick. Families that cannot offer that good stuff, when they add corporal punishment into the mix, create a truly volatile cocktail.
I say: have you checked that the violent kids had less corporal punishment than the non-violent kids, or are you merely assuming? Because from all I have seen and read, you seem to have the picture perfectly backwards.
And if that is so, what is the potential societal impact of what you have been writing of late?
There are many, many factors that need to be taken into account in terms of looking at what is happening in our society at this time. Children are being palmed off onto secondary caregivers at too early an age and get far too little time and attention from parents who work too much, drink too much and laugh too little. Horribly misleading “professional” information encourages well-meaning parents to use deeply harmful practises such as ‘cry-it-out’ sleep training. Children are fed things that lab rats shouldn’t eat. TV. I’ve barely begun the list. If only it were as simple as “bring on the canes.”
Your style is richly readable. But essentially, is your content currently socially responsible? Of course you have no obligation to be socially responsible. But I have a feeling that that is actually part of who you are. If so, are you really truly sure that you want to continue to actively recommend corporal punishment, without investigating the evidence in a whole lot of depth? Because what if what you are espousing is actually a key part of the cause of what you are fighting? And your wonderful way with words is carrying a whole bunch of cheering spankers, caners and bashers right along in your wake?
I have had the priviledge from time to time to be intimated with the other end of the spectrum – the children and adults who have been on the receiving end of your recommendations. And I have sometimes gotten to see a bit of that in technicolour and close-up – enough to make me passionate about trying to do something about it, in the few spare minutes I don’t really truly have, when someone sends me a link to something like your blog.
And I am sitting here tonight with you, thinking, “a disagreement may be the shortest cut between two minds” (Kahlil Gibran) and I’m wondering what you’ll write next.
Thanks for that Je’anna.
Guys I wonder if there are any child psychologists, researchers or social workers who would like to add to the views above.
As Je’anna correctly points out I am not an expert and I’m sure the guys would be interested in your views.
Je’annas blog is at :
http://lotsareviews.co.za/
Let’s not let this topic just grind to a halt. It is certainly one that touches us all.
Je’anna – We share a disgust for corporal punishment.
Michael, you’ve certainly got us talking. Like Je’anna, I’d like to just ask a few questions:
I was born to a successful academic and social family. My father didn’t get a Rhodes scholarship because his elder brother did. His first three children were outstanding specimens, excelling in most things that they put their hand to. They received endless praise and affection. Unfortunately, the last one was a runt. As a child, he was uncoordinated, he would not concentrate and he was unwilling to read. He got beaten relentlessly but that only made things worse.
Question 1
Is it fair to whip a child of four, five or six?
Question 2
Can a five year old be THAT naughty? that evil?
When, at seven this intervention hadn’t worked his mother (in part I think to protect me) suggests I be sent to the most prestigious private school. As this little boy was 3rd generation at this school, the father’s request that strict discipline was followed up. Each evening at dinner, the head master would call out the names of the boys who “deserved a thrashing” and at the end, he’d call out this little boys name and the whole school would laugh. Three thrashes every night.
Question 3
Did the beating help the child get through life or did it cause his life long battle with depression?
Question 4
Did the beating improve the child’s scholastic ability?
As a result of this, I never did get through school. I can’t catch a ball and the physical scares from the beatings are minor compared to the psychological ones, I suffer extremely bad depression. I’ve counselled many others equally abused. The problem is far more widespread than you’d expect (the scientific stats say in excess of 20% of the US population).
Well it turns out that I’m dyslexic, dispraxic (uncoordinated) and ADD. Hey, I never do things in half measures, if I’m going to have a learning problem, I’ll take them all.
Question 5
Was I personally responsible for these now well understood learning problems?
Punishment, appropriate, fair punishment, universally applied is both very good and very necessary but the evil inherent in any physical violence to children is just plain barbaric!
O, and just in case you think I was unteachable, I sign my name with a few of my qualifications, all got part time (at night!).
John Bond
Masters Degree in Business Administartion (UN) – Aged 49
Missed Summa Cum Laude by 3 marks
Post Graduate Diploma – Business Admenistration (UN)
Golden Keys Award for Scholastic Ability (and a scholarship) – Aged 46
Nat Dip – Org and Work Study (Natal tech)
Nat Dip – Matls. Management (Natal Tech)
As I review this, one thought comes to me – What a wasted life…
I am an educational psychologist, working with children, and increasingly also with parents, over the last 11 years, just answering quickly and off the cuff. I am also a parent.
There is a clearly established link between being abusive as an adult and having been abused as a child. While not all abused become abusers, many abusers have been abused. From my reading, what recent research is suggesting is that the common factor in the background of seriously distrubed and violent individuals is not exclusively abuse and harsh discipline (although it is there), but rather indifferent, neglectful parenting, that is parents who do not care. That not caring may manifest in not caring about the impact of violence and sexual abuse on the child, to a kind of neglect, to thoughtless overindulgence to avoid dealing with, thinking about and engaging with the child’s struggles. In private work I have watched a generation of indulged “spoilt” Jewish children, from both religious and more secular backgrounds grow into compassionate, even philanthropic adults, without the aid of physical punishment. Why? We internalise (take in) and learn from those who parent us. These children’s parents, and teachers, treated them, and eachother, respectfully and caringly and they learn to do the same. If a child’s behaviour was impacting on others they took time to understand why this may be so and took appropriate steps to help, like fitting a hearing aid, offering support for a learning problem etc.
Even in crime ridden South Africa how many murders do you anticipate seeing “up close and personal”? Most of us would answer “hopefully none”. Yet current generations can watch inumerable scenes of this kind in increasingly realistic detail, in a variety of contexts, from completely meaningliess conflicts and masacres to interpersonal situations depicting highly distrubed individuals. Some of these scenes are actually real footage. This is traumatising. Hearing about something does not have the same neurological impact that seeing and hearing the event presented in life like visuals does. War zone photographers are a seriously traumatised bunch. The only other humans to receive an equivalent exposure would have gone to war and felt intimately the effects of this violence in terms of losing friends – many did not survive – many wished they had not. But on games and film there is only the vicerally exciting visual and no thought or consequence need be engaged with. I worry about the impact of this on our children. Children tell me that violent games do impact on them and research does support the idea that watching violence can lead to more violent behaviour in children. Obviously children who’s parents are indifferent or neglectful are most at risk, in terms of what they might get to see and in terms of having no way of processing it and lacking alternative models of human relationships to compare it to.
I think adults need to have some boundaries – for themselves – in the sense of modeling the kind of behaviour we would like to see.
Honestly Mike how often have you hit your kids over the head with that book or anything else????? How did it feel and what made you do it? What did they learn?
I think hitting a child in the context of a good parenting relationship says “I lost control because you pushed me too far”. This is survivable. Regular physical discipline or the treat of physical discipline says “don’t step out of line our you’ll be made to feel it physically” or worse “He who weilds the biggest stick is the winner”. I would prefer my son to learn not to do things out of concern and empathy for others and the environment and respect for himself and his belongings. A generation of very well (physically) disciplined Germans carried out the Holocast attrocities. And our own township masacres? I hope to raise a more thoughtful son.
I think in South African society at present abuse is still a far greater risk than can in any way be weighed against the benefits of having physical punishment in one’s repetoire of consequences as a parent.
Many people are traumatised and the effect of violence and even shouting on traumatised individuals neurologically is even more distressing than those not exposed in this way.
I believe that there IS a crisis of balancing rights with responsibilities. I think this will be fare better achieved by parents acting caringly and responsibly toward their children, so they can internalise and learn from that model, emmulate the parents and teachers they love – not by the threat of physical violence.
I taught 45 preschoolers from disadvantaged backgrounds, without recourse to physical discipline or the threat thereof. True enough this is early on.
I am not without empathy for teachers facing classrooms of poorly parented older children. But am not sure that phsycial punisment is the solution. Adults need to get together and work on the problems that are issuing in violence. Caning was in place in my high school. Boys received canings for things that girls got lines for, and for more serious offences. Boys who were regularly caned dropped out of school to avoid the caning. Hard to see how this helped them or society. Boys with caring parents were often not caned because their caring parents complained. I leave it to you to connect the dots.
Belinda
Michael, I wholehearted endorse what Je`anna has blogged. If you want an easily readable, fairly technical but excellent survey of recent work on the effects of child rearing I am strongly punting a book published in 2004:
Sue Gerhardt: why love matters. how affection shapes a baby’s brain.
As a psychologist now working mainly with adults and adolescents I see the results of inadequte parenting directly in dysfunctional behaviour, and indirectly from the trauma caused by abusers who were themselves neglected or abused as children. I believe it is destrucive to blame and punish. It is not just about corporal punishment. Emotional and verbal abuse can do even more damage.
I am not blaming parents. My parents never hit me. They expereinced and learned from the destrucive effects with my older siblings. I suffered from witnessing paternal ragee from war trauma but also benefitted from my father’s kindly intelligence when he was stable. I am a parent myself, and now a grandprent. I have had a priviledged and long re-education to re-solve my own defensive behaviour, with several good therapists over decades but unfortunately cannot undo my own well-meant but tragic mistkes. Fortunately people can learn from others’ mistakes.
I speculate from the basis of solid research that corporal punishment is a cultuaral outgrowth of the instintive stress response. So is violence. But we do not have to be limited by crude genetic responses if we have the opportunity to develop and learn more effective ways. Unfortunately we are nowhere near being able to offer such education and therapy on a large scale. There is little insight from social and political leaders. We do not yet have enough parenting educaters or re-educated primary school teachers to do the job. But I beleive that we do need to explore this issue urgently. I agree with the Title of your stimulating article, but not with your solution.
It is fairly clear that we cannot hope to make a difference if we only focus on the individual without re-solving the destructive contexts that exist to influence that individual. Individual human beings and familiies have to live in cultural and socio-economic environments.
A bigger difficulty I think that we face is the vested interests of those managing and profiting from our global, consumer economy, which is not only harming Earth’s capacity to sustain human life, but which also values work, profit and wealth above family life and good parenting.I think that the the global economy has grown out of colonialist exploitation and is still closely linked to exploitation and war. But we have also learned much about the negaive effects of some socio-economic-political systems.
Very often the troubled child who acts out and kills is the product of troubled and inneffective parenting. We cannot paas the responsibilty on to teachers. And it is pointless to pass the responsibilty back to the parents without re-educating them if possible. Our prisons are nightmares and our mental hospitals underresourced.
But I believe that every positive effort contributes and makes constructive change more likely.
Wow, John. Well done on your triumph over all of that. Yup, have to say, your ‘wasted life’ comment brings to mind a topic I’ve considered plenty – what if all the time, energy and money spent either avoiding, compensating for, acting out on, or recovering from the horrors of childhood, was free to be invested directly in society and self? A world we can barely imagine…? A world we’d all love to live in…
Mike – see my indirect comment to you over on my own space -x- and that’s a big bonus smooch for you.
Guys thank you so much for all your efforts.
Please visit Je’anna’s site because this is a subject very dear to her heart.
It is a vital subject which needs ongoing debate and your contributions (John, Andre and Brenda etc)go a long way to telling parents why physical punishment is not desirable.
One point I would make guys – My assertion that I hit the kids with a child psychology book is Traps weird humor. Don’t take it seriously.
Ah! So that’s why there is so much violence in Sth Africa! TObviously, we need to teach the children peace with a shambok, and then, to reinforce the lessons, send them to the Army! None of this sophisticated rubbish about the medium being the message, hey Traps!
god take care of baby and fool’s