To have a baby is something that only women can do. A man can never feel his belly growing with life inside of it, feel a kick from the inside, or feel the body-crippling nausea that comes with morning sickness. They can never give birth, nor can they have a Caesar. They can never breastfeed, or lactate or feed another person from their body. Men, apart from a number of tiny sperm have very little to do with pregnancy.
Looking at it this way, there is a huge potential for pregnancy to be the ultimate feminist act. By becoming pregnant you exude woman-power — you are the only one in control of your body and your sexuality. You become a mother — a life-giver. You are a source of growth, nourishment and life. There is no duplicate of this in men. There is no such power. It is uniquely feminine.
But, what if this isn’t the case. What if through falling pregnant you condemn yourself to being the queen in the patriarchal chess game? What if, by falling pregnant you become subject to the needs of a patriarchal society. How would this happen? Let’s consider it.
So you fall pregnant. You are then a slave to your body for nine months to produce a child that will enter into a patriarchal world. Your body is heavily regulated by doctors, physicians and gynaecologists. In this way, you become objectified. You are an object that serves the purpose of repopulating the planet. Simply a womb. By being pregnant you support patriarchal structures that make women child carers, not only child bearers. You become a mom, with all the roles that are expected of you in that role, and face sanctions when you don’t subscribe.
I don’t know which side I’m feeling is most real. As a feminist, I don’t know whether I think being pregnant and having children is good for children or not. When your child is born the chances of that child rebelling and taking a feminist stance are pretty slim — after all, patriarchy is pretty enticing with its rewards for good looks and slenderness in women and athleticism and stoicism in men. What happens if your child turns out non-feminist (or worse! what happens if they are sexist???!!!???) — the terror is almost too great to think about.
Then again, we learn a lot about how we should live our lives from our parents. It could be really rad to have your kids wearing feminist slogans on their T-shirts (imagine a bib with “Mommy when I grow up I want to help smash the white racist, homophobic, patriarchal bullshit paradigm too”), or talking to their friends about how important it is to respect and empower women. How great to start a revolution from your own home?
I don’t know. I’m not convinced either way. Just because you can reproduce doesn’t mean you should …
If you want to have a bay so you can dress them up in slogans then you are better off buying a doll. Having a child, if it is a planned pregnancy, should really be abaout whether or not you can give the child the care and love s/he will need, giving the child the tools to make *their own* way through life. If that thought causes “terror” then I imagine it’s not for you. You would be no different to, say, the parents who force their daughters into beauty pageants from an early age.
Of course, having a child grow up under your influence, some of your values will rub off. That is the most you could do or should want to do. Their lives, their choices.
“there is a huge potential for pregnancy to be the ultimate feminist act…”
Thomas Beatie, the controversial “pregnant man,” gave birth to his second child, a healthy baby boy, in 2009.
Of course Thomas was a woman before becoming a man, but where does he fit into this whole act of feminism?
Good use of the word feminist though – I think I counted it 6 times in your article – to me that pretty much answers your question – you probabaly shouldnt have kids – you are too embroiled in your own feminist ways and your little one wouldnt stand a chance to be free from that.
“By being pregnant you support patriarchal structures that make women child carers, not only child bearers”. Nope – not if you don’t want to. I didn’t support any patriarchal structures. I spent very little time liking pregnancy, finding it terribly disempowering, but if anything the experience made me more bolshy than before. To truly dissect society’s structure – and look at how families can be supported. Men are child carers too, and they are invaluable to helping omen in nucleur families. The conversation is a very long one, involving adequate compensation for child care, whether paid work is preferable to the unpaid work of rearing another human being; paternity and maternity leave and whether profit is the bottom line. Having a child is INMHO neither feminist nor not, it is a biological function. it is how you structure life before, during and afterwards that matters. It’s made many things clear about being a good mother and being a good, whole person. Raising a family to be feminist can only happen if a pregnancy (or an adoption) happens. But don’t not get pregnant because it might be a patriarchal act. It’s not great, but it is up to you to determine how you’re treated. Us lucky middle-classers
Come now – raising kids is great. My ex left me with 2 teenagers (I fought for them) and I would not do it differently again.
Raising kids is not about being anything other than a parent. There is nothing feminist or patriarchal in the exercise. It takes 2 parents to create and raise great people, a truly team effort if you want to do it right and with the least amount of stress. Extended family is also very important in the whole process.
Instead of thinking feminist and patriarchal, think family. Then it really is a great experience for all people involved.
I think that people like feminists miss out on so much becasuse they put others in seperate boxes. A we versus them approach to life instead of just us.
Sorry, but I don’t see any “power” in being able to carry children. Pregnancy and childbirth are absolutely horrific and I personally find it monumentally unfair that men will never have to experience this. Nature is not fair. Nonetheless, I never even reached a point where I had to decide whether or not I was going to have children: I’ve known from childhood that I never would and am gloriously happy being childfree. As a woman, I’d rather find my “power” in financial independence, big horses and motorcycles, international travel, being able to make music, and so on. Oh well, perhaps “power”, like beauty, is in the eye of the beholder …
Instead of all this feminist analysis of whether to have a child or not, why don’t you just trust your instincts coupled with a bit of common sense? But, be aware that your child is an individual and not an extension of yourself even though your beliefs will help shape him or her.
My children were brought up in a home that discussed the evils or racism, sexism, homophobia, etc and, fortunately, they have grown up to eschew them. But, had they not, as unpleasant/awkward I may have found it, it would not have lessened my love for them.
If your child were younger than about 15 and were to wear clothing emblazoned with the slogans you mention, I’d regard it as a reflection of you rather than the child.
My children were taught to refer to a female adult as a ‘woman’ rather than, at that age, the more usual ‘lady’ which I regard as a sexist/patriarchal term. One day, in Pick ‘n Pay, my 4 year old son, sitting in the trolley, decided to call out to a passing woman in the aisle. ‘Woman, woman,’ he called out to her.
I almost squirmed with embarrassment – all my best intentions seemed laid to waste by what sounded a lot more sexist than had he called out ‘Lady, lady’.
That’s children for you.
Don’t, not until you have grown up a bit more anyway. And then if you have kids after that, they will help you grow further, no matter what silliness you fill your head with now.
most woman are happy being woman. my life experience has woman different to men on many fronts – which is great. men often achieve because of a supporting woman working with them in partnership/driving the men to gain materially. left to themselves many men would quit / tone down years before they do to spend more time fishing….. the woman in these type of parnerships don’t appreciate AA for woman.
Sheep can get pregnant; mice can get pregnant; donkeys can get pregnant.
It’s neither patriarchy nor feminism.
It’s biology. Simple as that.
What Anesh said. Mainly. I didn’t bother to dislike pregnancy or be disempowered by it. I was too busy getting on with my life.
So, you’re terrified your child might not embrace your values?
That puts you in great company.
@Owen and Atlas Reader,
Yes, carrying a child is biological, just like digestion for example. But pregnancy stops being simply biological when women become defined by their ability to fall pregnant. When being pregnant means that you are seen as a less reliable worker, or when having a baby means you are expected to stay at home while the man ‘brings home the bread’, pregnancy is no longer simply biological.
Its the issue of what is expected from women by virtue of their pregnancy that Jen is questioning here.
“Instead of thinking feminist and patriarchal, think family” — that’s like telling a goldfish to ignore the bowl its swimming in, and focus instead on its plastic house and treasure chest. Feminists are concerned with questioning with what seems normal and routine, because often that is exactly where power operates. And telling women to fall pregnant because ‘its natural’, or because ‘its what makes you a woman’ is a prime example of this power in operation.
If feminist women don’t have children, then only non-feminist ones will have children. The future belongs to those who breed!
I consider myself a feminist, insofar as that relates to personal choice and liberty for all. In this context, women can choose whether to have children or not. They should remain in control of their own bodies and not have procreation or lack theoreof forced on them. Finish and klaar.
That women are the childbearers is not up for discussion or debate. It cannot be changed. Its just the way things are. Its neither good, nor bad. Just biological. I cannot see how this becomes a big feminist question.
This is the equivalent of questioning the mechanics of sex.
Is it fair that the woman’s body is the receptacle? Who cares. Does it work? Yes. That’s what matters.
Are men and women different? Yes. Is it fair? I dont give two hoots. Does it work? Clearly yes.
Bottom line, I really, really don’t see the point of this discussion. Giving birth to me ia neither feminist/patriachal? Its giving birth!!!!
What a load of pretentious codswallop. Instead of all this pseudo-intellectualism get busy with the real issues at hand: get the nursery ready, buy the kid some clothes and toys. Children are a gift to treasure and love, and you will find when you hold your precious bub in your arms that all this woeful wittering you are indulging in means nothing at all.
Actually giving birth naturally with just a midwife and with no pain relief or forceps or any medical interference whatsoever has been the most empowering and perfect experience of my life. I now feel like i can achieve anything. You dont need to give your body over to the control of the patriarchal medical society when you fall pregnant, it is a choice women can make or not make.
Also, children are so amazing at broadening our minds, if they dont embrace your values, then just observe them quietly and see what you can learn from them.
Carla Bauer: I respect your opinion of not wanting to have children but I also have huge respect for your mother for considering pregrancy that gave birth to you so you can enjoy the travel and other things that you mentioned.
But comparing pregnancy to slavery is not understanding the role of a woman in the domain of creation. The first two persons on this good earth were created by the Creator and that role of nurturing life was delegated to woman and so to all of us it is very special and that is why every creature has a special bond with mother, it is natural acknowledgement of the supremacy and life giving aspect of a mother and if you feel the Creator was not fare with you, I run short of words to describe the disbelief.
Maybe you pray to be made a stone in the next life, that way you wont worry about pregnancy.
Atlas Reader:
It may be fashionable to contribute something in a blog by sometimes saying anything that a keyboard can agree to produce but there is no creature which has no regard for motherhood. Motherhood is special as I have mentioned in my comment to Carla above.
To be the cool or the main guy or centre of attraction everytime and everywhere, you do not need to say anything loud enough.
Lets us give praise where it befits so as to inspire and encourage our mothers, sisters and wives.
both pregnancy and parenthood are nothing you can actually imagine until you have experienced them. personally i disliked pregnancy and the way your body becomes seen as community property, but adore being a parent, so ultimately it was worth it. Love, and a sensible and informed grounding are the best ways to allow children to grow into confident and independant thinkers.
good luck, but dont overthink it. some people want to be parents and some dont. you already know where you stand.
“I don’t know. I’m not convinced either way. Just because you can reproduce doesn’t mean you should …”
What next?
I dont judge feminism or lesbianism, but this is rediculous. The purpose of being a female, is the ability to reproduce. The need to have children is built into the female psyche, and when this doesnt happen, it generally reflects that something went wrong somewhere.
I still have to meet a woman who has passed her child-bearing years, and are happy and fulfilled.
It is unwise to push such agendas, to influence women and risk their mental well-being. You also cannot fight nature, as nature will always win in the end, and the rebels who try, are not even a blip on the screen of nature, which has which has placed us into particular roles, over millions of years of evolution.
The Praetor
My problem is with young teenage girls, especially those from poor backgrounds and who are socially repressed; and who fall pregnant to make themselves relevant and to give themselves meaning and attention.
Child-bearing becomes an escape from the depressing hardship of a mundane existence. These younsters just fulfil their most basic role as a female being, while society must deal with the offspring.
To shine and be clucked over is a powerful need for a young girl who doesnt get the right kind of attention in her family and community.
@The Praetor
“I dont judge feminism or lesbianism”
What are you talking about lesbianism for? That’s not the issue
“The purpose of being a female, is the ability to reproduce.”
I think there are many women who would disagree with you there. And if the purpose of being female is to reproduce, what is the purpose of men?
“It is unwise to push such agendas, to influence women and risk their mental well-being. ”
Not allowing women to engage with issues like this in a public space is far more unwise than you telling us what we can talk about.
This drivel gives feminism a bad name. Turns out you can have your cake and be a martyr.
O, please, get a life and stop whinging.
Good grief, this blog just gets more insane each day.
Wow.
@ Jennifer Thorpe
I mentioned lesbianism because I personally find that your argument in this case, is used by lesbians quite often.
“The purpose of being a female, is the ability to reproduce.”
“I think there are many women who would disagree with you there. And if the purpose of being female is to reproduce, what is the purpose of men?”
Agree or disagree, but unless you dont know, biologically women were created with ovaries, womb etc, for the distict purpose and ability to reproduce. If this werent the case, why dont men have the same organs.
On the issue of the purpose of men, try having a child without one, even if it is just a donor.
Further I definately did not suggest that you or anyone else, cannot discuss things on a public open space, but on the flipside, discussing things on a public open space, means that it is open for discussion and critique…
Unless of course you are of a different opinion, and that your say-so is law.
The Praetor
@Ladyfingers… that was very funny. Hee hee. But, alas, no feminist extremists yet.
How come you don’t see it primarily as an issue of ethics insofar as doing what’s right for the planet and all the other species we muscle out when we reproduce. Or, what is the feminist view on being environmentally responsible?
@Praetor “I still have to meet a woman who has passed her child-bearing years, and are happy and fulfilled.”
I’m childless by choice and I have never had cause to regret that decision. Just as there men who should never be fathers, there are women who should never be mothers. Not everyone is emotionally, physically or temperamentally suited to parenthood–as the 100s of millions of abused and damaged children in the world prove. Beaten, starved, used as slave labour or beggars, or just plain ignored and emotionally or physically abandoned, abused children are at least as numerous as those who are more fortunate in their parents.
There are examples in nature of males who give birth (seahorses, for example) and others who have both male and female sex organs and self-reproduce. As one of the previous commentators observed, anyone can reproduce (unless there is a physical impediment) but few people make good parents.
If we are to survive as a species, we need far fewer people reproducing. Medical intervention has increased infant survival radically in the last 60 years with the result that the world population has doubled. If anything, people who choose to remain childless should have our approval rather than being criticized as ‘selfish’—an argument I just don’t understand. Surely, having children as ‘insurance’ for one’s old age is the selfish choice–one I have heard all my life as a valid reason to reproduce. Not in my book, it isn’t.
@ Kano: Um, where did I mention slavery?? I certainly don’t see pregnancy as slavery! Alot of women really want children and for them I’m sure pregnancy is mostly beautiful. More power to them!As for being made of stone, well, don’t assume that because I don’t have children that I don’t have feelings – that’s just ridiculous …! Oi, stereotypes ….
@ Praetor: I’m in my 40′s (so pretty much past my child-bearing years) and couldn’t possible be more happy and fulfilled!
@Siobhan: Right on – you said it all. Thanks!!!
Motherhood isn’t really special at all. Anyone functionally-female can do it. It’s only biology.
Most of us elect to wrap this experience in a swathe of positive hyper-emotionalism, clucking and tutting and congratulating to artificially build up the whole experience as something unique and special. Which it isn’t, not really. Not much different to the way we make a huge fuss over a baby who poos in a potty for the first time. It’s simply operant conditioning.
So, if having a baby is just simple uncontroversial and eternal biology, the whole “feminist/patriarchy” debate can only revolve around this social conditioning attached to having babies rather than the mere act of childbirth itself.
Are childless-by-choice women unfulfilled? Why? If not, why not? Feminism/patriarchy is just a pseudo-intellectual beating about the bush to avoid the nub of the issue.
the article was ok
!
the comments were so much better
very nice.
Carla Bauer – I admire and applaud your position and the way you put it.
“Just because you can reproduce doesn’t mean you should …”
Well said!
Um. Are you for real? Bringing a kid into a “patriarchal world?”… huh? If your mum thought like you, you would not exist. Maturity is realising that you are a part of a bigger whole. Thats what parenting is about. All the “feminist discourse” is mutual masterbation – you are part of a species… your are a mamal. Even feminists are born at some point.
@Rod: Thanks! Love your articles!
This kind of head-banging might be seen as forward-thinking but personally I think for individuals it just continues piling on the pressure and if we’re still having these feminist debate we’ve got nowhere.
In other words, on an academic level these things need to be debated but the minute we start personalising this debate and coming up with random personal examples, it becomes a tool of oppression.
I have days when I’m relatively happy with my life and my family give me immeasurable joy. Then there are the others, the despair and ‘what if’s and kicking myself because I might have a more impressive career and more self-fulfilment without that part-time stay-at-home sabbatical thing.
And do you know why that is? Because this stuff is too personalised. Do men have these debates about who’s life choices are ‘correct’? Of course not. Because at the end of the day people make choices and travel up the tree of their lives picking out which branch to climb. And do you know what else? Eventually you’ll have travelled to the edge of the canopy and you’ll fall off and die as the twig breaks.
You can scream ‘feminist’ on the way down but at the end of the day a combination of choice and circumstance can’t be defined by that one word.
And a further random aside: Didn’t Boris Yeltsin (in the days before he looked like a grey puppet shadow of his former self) claim he breastfed his daughter?
Pointless I know, but the act of breastfeeding, whilst intensely personal and all that, it’s still just feeding the kid at the end of it. Let’s try not to get mystical and use it as another battering ram to further abuse women, for anyone who was thinking about it. I try not to get mushy about it myself, in spite of spending much of about six years with the offspring (no, not the same one, for those who wish to get into that debate) hanging off my chest.
@ Praetor Read Mike Baillie’s comment above. Perhaps, a male ‘voice’ would be more acceptable to you. Thanks, Mike. It was a pleasure reading your comments–loved the goldfish analogy!
what Mike Baillie said x 1000!!!
I loved this article. It brilliantly sums up the conflicted world of being a feminist in today’s society. What I found truly sad was the level of stupidity evidenced by the majority of the comments. Ok there were the expected “you can’t be true woman and not really, really want to have little babies” nonsense. But even more scary were the “having babies is not an intellectual pursuit it’s all about biology”. Anyone seen a movie called idiocracy? I guess I should not be surprised since various studies have proven that the level of parents’ intelligence is inversely proportional to the number of offspring produced. For the idiots out there that means that the stupider you are the more kids you have. That’s why I’m proudly childless.
Oh gawd! Feminism is just so eleven minutes ago!
The only sensible thing in the article is the very last sentence.
As a black feminist women, I believe that having children is an investment rather than a liability.Feminist theories are generally eurocentric and there is a need to develop black feminist thought. i do however acknowlesge that there are limitations to having a child such as ur career, expenses and such, but this view is again based on a western perception of what is valued in society. I value having someone to take care of me when I am old, I value the spiritual enrichment that comes with bring forth life, i value sharing myself with someone that i have an eternal bond with and unfortunately i cannot get that from the western value that is largely centred around money and material things. I VALUE FAMILY AND COMMUNITY…try buying that with money.
@Mika the world sighed with a collective relief when you said: “That’s why I’m proudly childless.”