It is a glorious summer morning in Istanbul; colours of the sky resemble a messy oil painting; both resplendent and melancholic in one go. After roaming around the ancient Roman road in Sultanahmet, Divanyalo Caddessi, searching for a cheap but tasty joint to have breakfast, I find myself standing outside a quaint pastry and fresh juice café observing a young man set freshly baked cheese pastry on a plate.
Sitting down and planning the day in a café that lies adjacent to the ancient Constantinople-Rome road, seemed a rather fair, albeit admittedly ostentatious thing to do.
Istanbul, touted for centuries as “the city” of cities, the grand juncture between East & West takes splendour to the spectacular; it is difficult to imagine a more extravagant ancient city.
I share a table with a well built, slightly tanned man in what appears his early fifties. He sports a moustache, shoulder length curly black and grey hair and is dressed in a dark blue NYPD t-shirt.
Except for the seemingly inconsistent t-shirt, he was really the Turkish version of He-Man, Rambo or even Hulk-Hogan; the WWE version of Atatürk.
Sure, both Rambo and He-Man never sported moustaches and Hulk-Hogan was blonde even when he turned grey, but you get the picture.
“I am from South Africa,” I introduce myself to him, easing into my seat.
“Oh! You’re a long way from home!” he replies with a strong American accent that suddenly seems to make sonorous the bodacious letters across his chest.
I agree since Durban is, well, some distance from Istanbul.
He takes a bite of his delicious looking pastry, nonchalantly glances at me and asks how South Africa was doing since “the Blacks took over”.
“They have fucked it up haven’t they?” he says with a straight face.
I almost choke on the ice-cold coke streaming down my throat.
No exchanging of names, no discussion of what we did outside pastry cafes, no shared vision on the long legs of the passing dame; no ice-breaker -this guy went straight for the jugular.
“They are all a bunch of monkeys,” he adds as he laps up another bite of his pastry.
I try not to react, but my face creases and my eyes squint unceremoniously as I try to literally stomach the comment.
“I see you don’t like what I say”, he says nonchalantly, crowding the meagre morsels with his bulky sinews.
I feel rage creep up my oesophagus and I vow never to sit next to a stranger and gulp ice cold coke on an empty stomach again.
A waiter comes over and delivers my simmering spinach and feta pastry.
“Look”, I attempt finally at He-Man sitting across me, “our new government has done some really childish things and things aren’t rosy, yes. But it is not as if they inherited a country in good shape you know”.
“But the country is not the same as it used to be; these niggers can’t do anything right”, he retorts.
The vulgarity of this bloke unashamed to throw racist expletives at a stranger with his mouth full; what did his mother teach him anyway?
As I pull out my bread knife to slice the pastry into little cubes, I see it morph into a silver plated machete; this could only mean war.
It was easy to remind a fellow South African back home that his/her racism was unwelcome; I could even throw the first punch and be touted a hero for fighting the cause.
But I don’t remember agreeing to face up to Master of the Universe. Certainly not in Istanbul at least. This was not on the memo.
I felt the trepidation knot itself around the ribs of my chest; seriously now, was this really the moment for that fight?
I decide to take a bite of my pastry to mull over my situation.
The cheese spreads slowly in my mouth, sending love to all parts of the solar system. For split seconds my bitter disposition is forgotten, then returned even drier.
Why couldn’t he have said that Cleopatra was a man or that Gandhi was really a homosexual Moslem or that Osama bin Laden was a recovering nymphomaniac.
That would’ve at least been a little entertaining.
This was just not funny; not in this century at least.
I could try address the racism and he would probably break my knee-caps and dunk me into the Bosphorus or I could be more productive and focus on correcting his misconstrued sense of history.
But how do I get him to reconsider his racist views; to deter him from equating poor governance with “blacks” without me tangibly addressing his racist remarks?
This guy obviously got a hard-on from his racist talk, and I refuse to consummate his racist sentiment by acknowledging it.
At the same time I really did not want to be overtly defensive about the South African government whom I had limited faith in myself, but for different reasons.
So while I might think our politicians were a bunch of wankers, this is only because it has yet to be proven otherwise. They remain a species of their own, a worldwide phenomenon.
Life is about timing and this was not the time to sound like a brownish-pink-faced liberal defending the natives, I decide.
“I don’t know what you know about South Africa”, I begin, “but it was not one country before 1994. With the dawn of our democracy, two totally different, unequal worlds became one complicated country” I argue.
“Also”, I continue politely, “the idea that South Africa was some thriving country before the new government took over is just wrong”
“But they have taken a beautiful country and messed it up!” he presses on.
I shake my head determined to chew my food slowly just how my mother taught me.
“If you really want to talk black and white, South Africa had a white face, with a black behind. The country that you saw thriving was the front-end of a farce, while it attempted to hide all its shitty politics, inequality and prejudice, along with everything else detergent couldn’t whiten in its backside”
He motions a retort; his mouth viscerally opens to advance his position, but I stop slicing my pastry and look him in the eye.
“Look, what I am trying to say is that the country was pretty fucked up already”
His mouth freezes brusquely and his eye brows rise as he stares at me with scepticism.
The man, it seemed, was not accustomed to back-talk.
“Oh”, he says after a sizeable, contemplative silence had permeated the air.
“So do you think there is hope for your country?”
“I am not sure. There were a bunch of politicians running a brutal system before, and now, after ‘freedom’, we have a new bunch of politicians…whether they care about the ordinary South African is up for debate. And so no, this has nothing to do with being black or white. This is just politics”
I really didn’t want to be pedantic about colour; I fail.
He continues to stare at me (albeit with his mouth now closed) and I order a fresh orange juice.
This entry was posted
on Wednesday, November 11th, 2009 at 5:27 am and is filed under Perspective.
You can follow any responses to this entry through the RSS 2.0 feed.
You can leave a response, or trackback from your own site.
68 Responses to “‘The blacks have f***** it up haven’t they?’”
I do not understand the purpose of this article and what the author is trying to say. This man failure to mention that Turkey has been in turmoil for the last thousandth of years and doesn’t mention that.
[…] Thought Leader » Azad Essa » ‘The blacks have f***** it up haven’t they?’ www.thoughtleader.co.za/azadessa/2009/11/11/the-blacks-have-f-it-up-havent-they – view page – cached It is a glorious summer morning in Istanbul; colours of the sky resemble a messy oil painting; both resplendent and melancholic in one go. After roaming around the ancient Roman road in Sultanahmet,… Read moreIt is a glorious summer morning in Istanbul; colours of the sky resemble a messy oil painting; both resplendent and melancholic in one go. After roaming around the ancient Roman road in Sultanahmet, Divanyalo Caddessi, searching for a cheap but tasty joint to have breakfast, I find myself standing outside a quaint pastry and fresh juice café observing a young man set freshly baked cheese pastry on a plate. Read less […]
You were far too patient with that idiot. You should’ve told him what a piece of sh-t he was, turned your back on him, and walked away. That little speech you gave isn’t going to keep an absurdist like that from spewing that same nonsense to the next well-mannered passerby who’ll listen.
I fully understand your feelings. I have also had this kind of simplistic comment from people in the US, Europe, Asia (and even in the rest of Africa - surprise surprise) etc who make some dreadfully racist comment - people are less PC there as you note. And then are really surprised when I politely insist that SA’s problems are nothing to do with race, that there are good and rotten politicians of all races, that however much we may have concerns about the ruling party’s abuse of power these have nothing to do with race and everything to do with political culture…and you get looked at like one of the evil South Africans in Lethal Weapon 4 who is now reviled not because he is a racist but because he refuses to be one …
The point you make is merely a distraction because sure as hell SOMEBODY has stuffed up this country. But go on, just keep blaming “racists” while the country slides further into chaos (and keep denying that as well while you’re about it)People will never get a handle on the problems because race will always be too convenient to blame.
hmm…you should have given me a call so we can deal with him loxion style
Been in Istanbul for 9 months now, most turkish i have met can’t distinguish between Africa & South Africa and thez thänk Africa is one big country thats f….d up anyway.
Starts nowhere, ends nowhere. Next time just say class division still rules in a different mask and that it was white anglo-saxons that destroyed the world and that the Turks are in for a hiding when the Greeks, Armenians and Kurds get together to this end, as long as the Greeks give up keeping history-changing monkeys.
True that. We had Smith who messed up and the response was another brute who has equally messed up. It is the swing of the pendulum from one extreme mess to another and nothing in between. Very pertinent in our context as we have just gone through the day Smith declared UDI. Fing up is not the preserve of one race.
You write beautifully and I enjoy your work. As a citizen of the US I’m only sorry that this idiot you chanced upon was apparently an American. Although there are ignorant people within every continent, race and religion this doesn’t excuse his behavior.
“Great people talk about ideas.
Average people talk about things.
Small people talk about other people” Author unknown. You get bigots everywhere, why not just move on, or do you just want to stir the racial melting pot? I want my three minutes back!
For over 3 years living in the UK that is all I also heard when any local git would ask me where I’m from; “The Blacks are fucking up and that is why you are here”. It was always nice of me to remind them that their politicians were fucking up their own country (and just as well I left - the UK is on the point of bankruptcy!) and I never did blame Anglo Saxons for it.
Being a white South African I was keenly aware of the racecard games they played and I never did fall for it.
“… our new government has done some really childish things and things aren’t rosy, yes. But it is not as if they inherited a country in good shape you know”.
Is it “childish” to steal the money? Does inheriting a country in bad shape justify the pervasive level of government corruption? Every day, every single day there is another grotesque example of theft. Just in the last hour one has heard of bodyguards for officials at a municipality claiming 1.5 months of overtime for every month worked. Nobody, but nobody, even gets round to querying why a mayor and his sidekicks all need bodyguards.
Your country is not just “f… up”. It is bizarre beyond belief.
Yoh that was a hectic encounter! But one thing I am discovering about racists is that no sane argument can convince them otherwise and getting angry at such blatant ignorance is not even worth it. The government pre-”democracy” was terrible, the government post-”democracy” is still awful. Maybe good governance is just not something engrained in the South African psyche.
Pity it had to be an Aryan skinhead on steroids to give you a foreigner’s perspective on post-apartheid South Africa. You’ll be shocked how many decent non-racists share that opinion. Circa 1994-1998: The euphoria of the miracle of reconciliation was upon the world; being South African overseas was generally met with excited comments about Mandela, his grace and promise.
White South Africans and emigrants were considered Nazi Lite so to speak, as if they were en route escaping impending Nuremberg Trials. It was a great time to be South African and Black in New York and the States; at least for me it was.
So, foreigners didn’t always think we had fcuked it all up. IMO, they didn’t until one great African Crusader decided to take the whole world in a deranged quest to change the worldview on African development and amongst other things…AIDS.
Then, slowly SA’s image took a beating due to our tragic failure to solve our health epidemic problems, to deal with crime and corruption effectively, and to defend democracy both inside SA and around our borders.
Worse, for the last 10 years we presented an image of tone-deafness, intransigence and unbridled arrogance whilst failing to govern. And so, we are no longer the toast of the world anymore. Even developing countries think we take ourselves too seriously, i.e., “We are punching above our own weight.”
Kholekile Tshunungwa on November 12th, 2009 at 9:41 am
I have always been stunned by the sence of accuracy that some people seem to pesess(americans as seen in movies). e.g somebody would describe a person that they only had a glimpse of “he was six foot two and weighed 172 pounds”.No approximations just pure pin-point accuracy.
I only realised later in life that some people have an in-built disability to say ” i do not know” but, never miss an opportunity to shoot off their mouths.
As far as accuracy of information, and reliability thereof, from other people goes, i’ll rely on my Polish friend Igor Szymansky. When asked what the distane from PTA to JHB is, he responds the best way he knows how: “about three dumpies”
Thanks for your patriotic effort to dispell the racist white lies that when blacks (Africans) rule then they ruin. The white minority racists in this, our country, persists with their propaganda to bad mouth our beautiful land and its people with racist bile that shape interntional perceptions of racism. They do this overtly(remember the racist application for refugee status in Canada, the Mandela CD, I thought I saw a baboon)and covertly through racial insults that victims of racism are themselves racist. We are strongly moving (despite our colonial and apartheid inherited challenges) towards a nonracial, nonsexist, democratic and prosperous SA whether post apartheid white racists like it or not. Power to the People!
No doubt an amount of poetic license has been used here. Without saying it, the author makes it very clear the American is uncouth, uneducated, unwise, uninformed and badly dressed, while portraying himself as the calm, knowledgeable, reasonable, educated, civilised thinker. I am of the opinion the author is making more of a personal rant than an informative article. This is an opinion column yet he seems not to have one in this instance.
You know, I honestly think there is room for everyones views in this world if they are correctly justified and can be backed up with concrete examples.
Blacks have ruined everything is not an example of that.
I don’t like people like that, they are the people who wallow around in their inconsequential lives desperately looking for other people to pay attention to them. They often start baseless arguments they will never win. My favourite is “South Africa is the next Zimbabwe”. This line usually comes up at a braai after a couple of beers, it is usually followed by rousing cheers from the 50 somethings as they proceed to develop their political fantasy.
I am so happy that this particular one met you and that you dented his ego like you did.
And by the way, it doesn’t help that the ruling party largely does nothing about its own and most vocal leaders who continue to project a disturbingly Africanist, if not anti-white image*. Sometimes, you’d forget this is the ANC talking and not PAC. This unabated hostility even to fellow ANC leaders who are not Black, entrenches in the minds of critics that it is only the Blacks who want total control and thus who have fcuked things up, when this is far from the truth.
* I am referring to the “dogs are biting men (Xhosa saying)” scenario in the case of Julius (and to some extent, COSATU) being disrespectful and uncomfortable with the “undue” prominence of white and coloured seniors (Manuel, Hogan, Gil Marcus) in the so-called strategic areas of power. One gets the sense that these leaders, who happen to be NOT Black, are the only ones in the NEC who care about setting the record straight to Julius or whoever else is out of line. The president and most other senior Black leaders, save for Gwede Mantashe and Netshitenze to mention a few, are largely silent, whilst Julius spews rabid racism at not just the opposition but other bigwig ANC insiders who are correctly fed up with his incorrect expression of ANC policies.
Kholekile Tshunungwa on November 12th, 2009 at 11:21 am
Great article thank you Azad. The Turkish government is a US stooge government, heavily supported with US military and other “aid”. Turkey has yet to come to terms with the Armenian genocide.
Somehow, the US has a predisposition to associate itself and support brutal regimes, like they did that of South Africa, of Pol Pot in Cambodia, of Colombia and of Egypt to name a few.
I spend a lot of time with Americans and in my opinion they are amongst the most undereducated and ill informed on the planet. Their education system is geared to pumping out mindless robots to unquestioningly accept the propaganda their media pumps out.
It always helps to have facts and figures available to counter them and it clams them up quick:
From the Journal of African Economies published by the Department of Economics of Oxford University:
Quote: South Africa’s real economic growth rate stabilized and improved during 1995 - 2004 relative to the previous decade, from an average of 0.8% (-1.3% in per capita terms) to 3.1% (+1.1% in per capita terms).
Moreover, measured in annual terms since 1994, the improvement gathered pace, and in real growth averaged 5% during 1994 to 2006. Unquote.
I challenge anyone to show me a ten year period when the apartheid guavament EVER achieved the same?
Evertime I’m overseas and mention that I’m from South Africa the response is the same. ‘How are thing going? I hear the political situation is a mess.’
Truth is, by their standards South Africa is a complete mess. I get the impression that overseas people see it as an African malaise, but most who I’ve met wouldn’tbase it on race. At least overtly like the idiot in the article.
I think most of the international world think it’s beyond blaming the poor standards of governance and terrible leadership in Africa on colonialism and apartheid.
After the 1994 election I was a proud South African, smug in the fact that we had the best President ever. Nothing could touch us, we were above petty fighting and as the Rainbow nation, an example to the rest of the world. We were going into the future confident of excelling at every thing we did, a united force that would improve the lot of our poor.
What happened??????????
Right off ask why the country was in bad shape at the time? Moreover has the promised captial flows inproved? The flight capital surely has but fixed investment no. There are reasons.
Instead of feeling defensive you should have taken the chance to ask why and what. You may have learned about how others, racist or not see us as a nation.
I mean everyone I come across thinks that Mandela was put away for treason and not for planning to kill the innocent. So discussions like this do help. Take the time to learn from others.
So the guy that you met in Istanbul think the blacks f*****d up South Africa - does his opinion really matter here, unless if you do actually believe that the country is indeed f****d up, meaning someone is responsible, and at the moment, who is the most likely responsible?
Bottom line is, we cannot change everyone’s opinion on race, but we certainly can change the performance of our country. So, if the country is F****d up, lets focus on fixing it and making it prosper.
Otherwise if we over empasize the race issue, it might actually become a self fulfilling prophecy.
Now, lets get back to work and build this country.
Interesting comments from all….Don’t agree that the country was already F…..d up when they took over. We were the powerhouse of Africa and ahad a decent standing in the world - at least there was proper schooling (including farm schools), which might not have been on the same par as the white ones, but what has changed - the kids still do not get a proper education, health care in a shambles, roads falling to pieces, municipal services dead or dying) 2 Million tax payers staggering under the load of the social grants to the rest of the spongers, - then not to even mention the blatant, couldn’t care a sh..t who finds out, stealing thats going on - EVERYTHING is falling apart, so the comment that they inherited a failed country is simply a load of rubbish…come on, take off the blinkers, this boat has sunk…..
Pray tell, in which spheres of governance was South Africa a failing state under the ancien regime? Would PW have done nothing while 6 million South Africans were becoming infected with HIV?
South Africans, especially our leaders should learn this and start to change the perception. By contributing to the perception of creeping Africanisation, this is what we must expect.
In any other country, the ANC would have been voted out based on their behaviour and performance.
I seriously doubt that there are any intelligent South Africans who are unaware of the problems of corruption and mismanagement in government. The blog as I understand it is about how racist perceptions such as the particular guys are so offensive and wrong. Trust me we know that things are not rosy in South Africa, you don’t need to point it out to us.
People often use it as a means of establishing rapport and common ground with their audience. You are doing it here too - “I met a horrible racist who was nothing like you, gentle reader”.
Elsewhere on this site it’s “I met a horrible Dutchman called Chrysanthemum” or “I met a horrible Chinese person who inspected my bottom” or “there are horrible yobs in England who vomit a lot and are most unladylike”.
What you don’t usually get in any direct way is the prejudice that is aimed at you. There are people in France who will give me the cold shoulder because they see me as a Brit, people in London who are unlikely to warm to me on account of my whiteness, others who won’t because I am from South Africa, and a third set who will maintain their distance because I occupy a slightly different position in the class spectrum.
Each of those groups say horrible things about Brits, whites, South Africans and the class that they aren’t. They just don’t say it to your face but to others with whom they gossip about you.
I am not defending the He-man but could it be that he looks at this country from the outside….and thats how things look from the outside…of course his view is completely racist (anonymous - walking away would achieve nothing, the authour handled the situation pefectly, trying to address his ingnorance and perhaps change his mind dimplomatically) and without reliable information. Many viewpoints similar to He-man are based on the state of other african countries, third world if you like, that rely on first world funding to function, therefore giving nobs like He-man entitlement to spew uneducated comment from their crumb filled faces.
This country is f…ed. Zuma talks the talk, but nothing happens. Pls. show mw a Gov. Department which is not stuffed. Ceo’s gets fired. but they refuse to go. Huh? Some Ceo’s earn in exess of R500000.00 pm from Government parastatles and are still involved in the private sector.Huh? Ceo’s are allowed to tell lies and they get away with it. Municapalities are not functioning at all. And as soon as something goes wrong (every day) the race card is pulled. Please employ people who can do the job. Does’nt matter whether they are black or white or pink! As the black revolution lied dormant for many years whilst growing into a massive force, so is the poor revolution waiting to explode. The poor is getting fed up with Government fat cats who is just getting fatter and fatter. How does one really explain the situation in our lovely country to a foreigner? Half the salaries of these Ceo’s and you’l be surprised how many poor people can be fed. But hey, who cares anyway?
@Kholekile Tshunungwa
You make some very good points. My SA friends seem shocked when I say that I wouldn’t have moved to SA before 1995 (as I did), but I wouldn’t have moved there after 2000 either. The mood has changed, a lot of water (amongst other things) has gone under the bridge since then.
There are some South Africans who would like foreigners to think that Mandela is being carried around on the shoulders of the boks every day for eternity, but they know this isn’t what has happened.
Unfortunately SA chose Thabo Mbeki, Zuma, Malema etc. to represent them. If they had raised the profiles of people such as Moeletse Mbeki and Mamphela Ramphele, the world would have seen a different story.
Raking in the views dude,impressive (expletive in title works like a bomb Haha)
You shuda klapd dat guy wit ‘A Long Walk to Freedom’ (1 heavy book dat) then he’d know how it feels to be f***** up by da blacks. Lol
Azad life is about self-preservation, self-interest, self-survival and somewhere if you are decent enough you find equilibrium! Equilibrium against the counter interests of your opponents.
The problem is that the western world wants blacks to bend over, be nice, accomodative and pleasing to them! The fact is it’s over, I am not going to do it. And I am not wrong or hateful or spiteful for looking after my interets and myself. I dont believe in christianity, capitalism or free market, I will do so when these things start to work in my favour. I will strive every waking moment to achieve this. I dont go around hating whites, but in any matter my perception, my opinion my interest should take precedence. History is on the march and I am the new thing that must take over. Maybe 300 years down the line someone will depose me but right now its my turn! So the only thing left for people like your coffee shop friend is that I myself should imprison myself for him! I am not going to imprison myself in some kind of mental prison full of self-doubt and irrational mea culpa.
Azad reacted as we all do when ‘our own’ are criticised. I can bitch about my own family/husband/child as much as I like, but the hackles rise when an outsider does the same…
The thought occurs that perhaps we should send Julius and friends off for an extended holiday elsewhere. They may just find that foreign ‘others’ can be more racist than their countrymen and women.
I’m fascinated by the level of racist retorts pieces like this attract here. I thought we were all meant to be trying to play nicely together?
Fact remains that there are uncouth people of all races all over the world and that governments are generally slandered because they are governments, not just because of their colour.
So let’s take bets: first it was Eskom, now it’s Armscor. Who next? Let’s play multiple choice…
SAA
Telkom
SANRAL
ACSA
SAQA
SITAs (the list is endless)
…at last our government is beginning to cotton on to the fact that ownership = responsibility.
Why do I say this?
“…is a prospective Botswana-based IPP which is already working with government, bypassing Eskom…” (courtesy of Engineering News) Bet Eskom’s CEO/not CEO didn’t like that!
Dear Mr Hill
I agree with your information about SA’s average GDP since 1994, but on a point of fact - you ask ‘I challenge anyone to show me a ten year period when the apartheid guavament EVER achieved the same? ‘ Well, the answer is the 1960’s - a period of enormous growth for the SA economy averaging over 8% per year, and probably the greatest boom period in industrialised SA’s history. Of course, my opinion is that this success was despite the apartheid ‘guavament’, not because of it, and was largely driven by external factors coupled with rapid industrialisation and investment in infrastructure.
funny thing is, if you had spent a couple of minutes probing him you would have found this big lump of dumb gets all his local saffa news from a bitter Ex-saffa who lives in his home town and tells the story at the local bar, how he fought off blacks with a knobkerry while protecting his virgin daughters from attack and used his BMW with side mounted flame throwers to get away some where safe (probably with a lot of money to keep away the bad feelings)…. SA ex-pats all over the world cannot wait to down the country to foreigners…
South Africa has, and has always had the potential to be an economic powerhouse. Sad thing is, the captains of industry there are now not chosen on merit, but on colour (blacks only) and on political connections. It is amazing how “Marxist freedon fighters” have become megalomaniac capitalists virtually overnight. It also seems inconceivable that a government composed of those who objected so violently (with guns & bombs, burning people alive etc) to being discriminated against on the grounds of their colour or race, have now disgracefully re-imposed many of those very same discriminatory laws, this time against an ethnic minority, the whites. Any criticism of blatant incompetence or corruption amongst top officials (all black) by any white, is immediately labelled “racism.” Yet the government always talks of Africans, Coloureds and Whites, as if the coloured and white South Africans, are not Africans. Yet whites (who have been there for 350 years) and coloureds/Khoi (for millenia) have historically been the majority in the Western Cape province, now the only province ruled by the white/coloured local majority opposition, and the only province with any semblance of law and order and good governance. So, what is the majority black government’s stance on this? They have pledged to make that province “ungovernable!” Yes, it seems like the catchy headline to this article is in fact spot-on. When will the world wake up to the reality that the biggest racists on this earth, are black, not white?
the guy later revealed he was a Turk who left for the US and worked as a policeman in NYPD. So he was not ‘from the US’.
We all have strong views about race and/or racism, but when we are put on the spot like that - in a foreign setting - how do you know if its the time to wage war - if its worth it or not?
And how do we get people to stop linking colour and governance/performance?
And if he had not insulted or used race so explicitly, would I have thought he was focusing on ‘the facts’ as he saw it or being implicitly racist?
me..you are sooo wrong, my son and daughter in law are very patriotic about SA and if any one there says anything negative about SA they are up in arms. The reason they live and work there is that at this point Wall street is the financial centre of the world and the experience gained working there is priceless. I must admit I feel secure in the knowledge that they are not subject to the crime we have here.
Given that the ANC is basically nothing more than COSATU, what we have in SA at the moment, is a tiny percentage of ANC(read COSATU)officials in government and a massive majority of illiterate, uneducated and desperately poor people who keep falling for their lies and voting for them.
It’s a classic communist situation, those in government are rich and privileged and those who aren’t in government are poor beyond belief (read ‘equal’ in COSATU and SACP parlance).
The only hope is the South African middle class. They are the ones maintaining the economy, and they are the ones who see the ANC alliance’s inefficiency and dishonesty. If only the opposition parties representing this middle class could find some way of working together. Then South African may have a future.
You ommit to mention that when PW Botha was State President more than 20% of state expenditure was on Defence. That 20% was supposedly diverted into the RDP and you trumpet the 3% growth rate? (What happened to the balance? Is it now Joe Modise’s bank balance?)
Now, we have service delivery riots, xenophobia riots, more service delivery riots…
You quote the growth figures from 1994 to 2006 as looking good, and in some way implying that it was down to the new Government I think. To an extent the “feel good” thing that happened after 1994 was responsible for a lot of “growth” with lots of outside investment looking for secure base to start working with the rest of the continent. I was part of it and saw it. The fact is the whole world started going on a mad credit fuelled spending spree at the same time and South Africa was no exception. The consequences of this blew up in 2008. South Africa will also pay the same price as the rest of the world’s economies for reckless spending. While your numbers may be correct your interpretation of them is not.
Another short observation of Mr Hill’s numbers.
Mr Hill the period you refer to prior to 1994 is important as well. You show that SA’s growth figures were miniscule and I would agree. The fact is that for many years South Africa’s government was fighting a series of wars against organisations and movements that were supported by a brutal Russian regime and under sanctions as well. Hardly fair to compare I think.
I do agree with your observations about Americans in general though!
LOL, julias has competition, in the looks, and mentality departments ….
You can window dress it all you want, the simple fact remains, the ANC is a black government. Until the ANC get rid of the racism in their organization, the polarization will remain, and it will always be seen as a “black government”, not a South African government. One day, in the far far distant future, when there is finally real integration, and a non racist government, then it will be a South African government, and no longer a “black government”. As much as we live in denial, the truth remains that deep down we all know this.
@me that is blatantly not true…most saffas abroad have nothing but praise and fond stories to tell to dumb lumps like he-man, but then it only takes one to f&*k it up!
Bare in mind that Some expats have also left for a reson, the raping of a dughter or a wife would be a pretty good reason if you asked me.
Reading this article, I cannot shake the feeling tha Azzad agrees with this man. In fact, I have a sneaky feeling that this encounter is made up. Azzad you want to express certain opinions about your government but you don’t have the guts to tell it like it is without creating a ventriloquist. Oh! gracious God, we are not fooled!
Even if this encounter did in fact take place (which I very much doubt) why would you think it warrants any mention here? Racist rant from an unknown man who is (not Turkish and not American) but actually Turkish and American. Heaven have mercy on you. We are not fooled.
In 1994 we had an Eskom that worked. We had hospitals and schools that worked. We had roads and airports that worked. We had Government and municipalities that worked, We had criminals that were caught and sent to jail in courts that were able to keep the law.
We had apartheid that did not work and that was despicable. All of this has been fixed and now we have nothing to look forward to but more degradation. What has this to do with Race??
It is all to do with incompetence and the blind leading the blind whilst they feather their own nests.
We did not develop the good things for the benefit of all - we destroyed a great country and have replaced it with an ever developing mess. As in Zimbabwe where Mugabe is proud to be “President’ of a pile of ashes so too this is what we look forward to. There is no substitute for ability and experience, and ability and experience has nothing to do with colour. Don’t keep blaming apartheid. In the destruction of apartheid every thing else has been destroyed too. How stupid can we be??
I think your comment does not just shows us about how people from outside perceive our country post apartheid, but even inside this country we still have people who relate our problems(in terms of gorvenance) along racial lines. Most of Our current misfortunes are due to the past atrocities done by the Apartheid Goverment who happened to be white. To just say white people are racist would be wrong, to say black people are incompetent would not be correct, however I concure with Mark Robertson who said politicians of all races are rotten!!
I had exactly the same experience here in Canada, except that the exchange involved a highly-educated and well-travelled Asian gentleman. I was also taken aback for a few seconds, then realized that he was being completely honest and wasn’t trying to provoke a response. He’d experienced it firsthand and I realised he was actually delivering a very good summary of SA’s sitaution. Sometimes the truth hurts, eh ? But that doesn’t make it any less of a truth.
Having spent many years working in Turkey, the UK and the USA I have been subjected to differing view by individuals in all 3 countries.
There are not many Turks residing in SA therefore what is happening here is poorly reported and their general perception of Africa is that the whole continent is a shambles. Most Turks would not differentiate Kenya from Zimbabwe or Zimbabwe from SA.
Big city Americans have more savvy and are conscious of race, but rural Americans tend to be blind to anything much further afield than the state they reside in; most are simply not interested.
The Brits have to walk on eggshells with anything that is race related; trouble is heading your way if you talk out of turn. With a large amount of South Africans living in the UK, combined with millions of UK relatives living in SA, the Brits are quite clued up about SA and what is happening there. Generally they think that SA is going downhill at an alarming rate.
The view of one idiot who you meet in a restaurant in Istanbul means nothing in the global context of how SA is seen at present. He was nothing more than a racist bigot but how SA is seen by those who can have an effect, be it business or political clout is important.
I agree with Phillipa’s astute observations. This entire yarn is contrived to serve the purposes of venting the author’s hidden thoughts. I fail to see any other purpose for this disgraceful article based on hearsay and innuendo.
We do have freedom of speech in this country, and I’d have more respect for you if you had the courage to speak your mind instead of cowardly maligning the poor Turks and Americans as racist pigs.
People who aren’t perceived as white in the USA often try to compensate by being ‘more white than the whites’ through hating blacks - see e.g. Stan Goff’s Hideous Dream… Although how the hell people from Turkey can fail to be perceived as white mystifies me…
As to Paul S - wow, it’s blackness that makes RSA so violent, e.g. as in comparison with Botswana. Get a life. Of course, (east) Asian attempts to be more white than whites is little different from west Asian attempts at the same. Shamepies.
Perception is reality.
Mike on November 12th, 2009 at 12:46 pm
Sorry Mike. That shitty expression is being peddled everywhere. What Asmal used to say as I recall is :’The perception is as important as the reality.’Which is more likely to be true.
The perception was that there were WMD’s in Iraq. The reality is that there weren’t. Now go figure out your own exmples and stop others from repeating such a bullshit meme. Ta.
It’s difficult to know what to say about Phillipa Lipinsky; she is so filled with hatred. Is there no way her rants can be prohibited from the mg site?
All comments must be approved by our editors, click here to read the editorial guidelines for comments. Please allow some time for our editors to approve your comment after posting.
profile
Azad Essa is a journalist at Al Jazeera.
He is also the author of a book called "Zuma's Bastard" (Two Dogs Books, October 2010)
Yes, it is the name of a book. A real book. With a kickass cover.
Click on the cover to find out more.
You know you want to.
or join the revolution:
www.facebook.com/zumasbastard
http://www.azadessa.com/about
Accidental Academic won best political blog at the South African Blog awards 2009 and is a finalist for 2010.
Azad's links
IOLS-Research Industrial Organizational & Labour Studies Research Unit, UKZN
In a dramatic turnaround, South African journalists have welcomed the proposed changes to the Protection of Information Bill and the Media Appeals Tri...
If you haven't sniggered, burped or laughed at the recent Zapiro-Muslim cartoon debacle then you probably had a very pleasant weekend. Other citizens...
Tens of thousands of Muslims marched through the streets of Paris yesterday to bid farewell to the burqa that is due to make its way out of French soc...
As racial tensions continue to rise over the murder of Eugene Terre'Blanche, and renewed concerns about the ability of black people to host thousands ...
I am at Moses Mabhida Stadium for a tour, when the cute journo I'm chatting to spots a giant leopard bobbing his fractious head for a couple of photog...
Loading ...
I do not understand the purpose of this article and what the author is trying to say. This man failure to mention that Turkey has been in turmoil for the last thousandth of years and doesn’t mention that.
(Report abuse)