Get off your high horse

The general response to South African drug smuggler Janice Linden being executed has been mixed. Some say her crime was not severe enough to warrant the death penalty, but many lambaste her for being part of an industry that ruins people’s lives and being “stupid” to commit a crime in a country that carries the death penalty.

Those who go on about the evils of drugs and what they do to people have obviously never been close to an addict or alcoholic. Addiction will always exist, because approximately 15% of the population will always have an addictive personality.

Drug abuse is a public health and social issue that has been criminalised with disastrous results. Just like the prohibition of alcohol gave rise to highly organised crime syndicates, which, due to their illicit nature, resulted in truly heinous crimes such as murder, so too has the global illegal drug trade resulted in massive suffering for hundreds of communities. Mexico and Colombia being prime examples.

It is a law of economics that where there is demand, somebody somewhere will find a way to supply. Making drugs illegal only shames and pushes the problem further underground. It is a moral decision rather than a pragmatic one — based on judgment and fear rather than a desire to truly help people.

There is also a reason that drug mules are usually women. Many are coerced into carrying out their “crimes” by boyfriends or husbands. They are easily disposable tools in the gigantic operations of drug syndicates.

Those who say Linden “deserved it” are naïve if they think executing a low-level smuggler will do anything to bring down the Mafia, Zeta and Triad bosses who control the industry. This is not even a blip on their radar. But then people don’t really care about that. They are simply morally outraged about drug use, even though alcohol kills thousands on our roads and in homes every year.

What if she had smuggled three litres of whisky into Saudi Arabia and was sentenced to death? Would everyone be saying she deserved it for breaking the laws of that country? In South Africa’s happily hypocritical state of alcohol acceptance and drug condemnation, I somehow doubt it.

The South African public’s self-righteous response is sickening and a sign that we still have a very long way to go as a society.

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50 Responses to “Get off your high horse”

  1. Ly #

    Please also don’t forget that she insisted she was innocent right up until the end, even though doing so cost her her life.

    Maybe she was guilty and maybe she wasn’t. She was STILL a South African and should’ve been protected by our government and tried on South African soil.

    December 13, 2011 at 1:01 pm
  2. Sir James vannie Kaap #

    I certainly agree, that condemning Linden is pathetic, especially if the possibility existed that she was innocent. She insisted on her innocence, leading up to her execution, however with an increasing number of poor South Africans choosing to become drug mules. The real naivety lies with the belief that easy money is but a flight away. We certainly don’t know if Linden was coerced by “a boyfriend” or that she did it willingly, but the fact of the matter is, if she did the crime and the laws of the country you’re caught in carries a maximum death sentence charge, then silly postulations fall out of the window. It would be like trying to justify a murder. Oh, but Susan was bullied at school, or her husband was abusive, so certainly he “deserved” to die.

    My personal view is that the sentence was excessive (and that China should be condemned for it), especially since drug mules are mere vectors, and never the source of the drugs, however, this is the same drug, that has ravaged the suburbs and townships of Cape Town.

    December 13, 2011 at 1:16 pm
  3. chantelle #

    And your “feel sorry” attitude towards criminals are just as sickening. You, and people like you are what’s wrong with our society. The human rights activists who don’t give a damn about victims’ rigts. And to say that the ones who carry on about the evils of drug abuse have never been close to an addict is so self righteous. My best friend died 3 years ago at age 40. HIV/Aids. Caused by her giving her body away to anyone prepared to give a fix for it. I miss her every day of my life, and if I could personally carry out the death sentence to each and every one of her suppliers, I would. Furthermore, I stay in the drug mecca of Jo’burg. Rosettenville, Turffontein area. If just one, JUST ONE, of the dealers and sellers who practice their trade so openly on every street corner, is executed by the law, what a difference it would make in our area. It is the easy availability of drugs in this country that makes it the problem it is today. And yes, if someone is executed in a Muslim country for smuggling in 3 bottles of whiskey, I’d also say they mut take the punishment if they want to break any country’s laws. That is what being an adult is all about.

    December 13, 2011 at 1:20 pm
  4. Sir James vannie Kaap #

    But I do agree with you that South Africa has a strong hypocritical edge to it, especially with most discussions oozing with illiterate and uneducated emotive goo (which incidentally seems to be universal across all racial groups).

    December 13, 2011 at 1:21 pm
  5. gaya #

    Amanda, Don’t let the ladies saying they were forced by boyfriends etc to be mules fool you into believing them. Sun City, where I spent 3 1/2 years of my life, are full of ladies from SA and especially South America who received short sentences for exactly that excuse, bragging about how they know they can manipulate the law to receive shorter sentences by acting the innocent.

    December 13, 2011 at 1:25 pm
  6. Warren #

    I agree with most of what you said and I don’t believe she should have been executed. I’m even more upset with government for allowing it to happen in a state is has good diplomatic relations with. If she is a drug mule though, then she knew the consequences. No drug mule doesn’t know the consequences so she should have been ready to face those consequences no matter how unreasonable they may be.
    My real problem is that she could have been innocent. I’m sure syndicates use unsuspecting travellers luggage to smuggle drugs though customs and then just retrieve it on the other side. That’s how I would do it. I’d have an easily bought ACSA employer stick it in an easily identifiable suite case and I’d get on the same flight as the owner and would have someone on the other side retrieve it.. or I’d rob him on the other side if that weren’t possible.

    December 13, 2011 at 1:31 pm
  7. Toni Benoni #

    I’d be happy for a south african to lose their heads smuggling booze into Saudi, its Saudi law. We have 0 law enforcement in our little zoo on the southern tip of Africa. Rule of law means the law applies to everyone equally… and we south africans don’t like that definition one bit. We never have since year 0….

    December 13, 2011 at 1:37 pm
  8. Kurt #

    Interesting take on this Amanda.

    Good read.

    December 13, 2011 at 1:43 pm
  9. cathy raats #

    I agree with Amanda especially her final comment though it is not exclusive to South Africa. The vast majority of the world have similar attitudes.

    The death penalty appeals to the basest of our primitive instincts and cures nothing as the Chinese and USA experience shows.

    Although a controversial thought I believe that legalizing drugs may well make dealing with its known dangers more affordable due to removal of the cost of law enforcement.

    Just a few observations.

    December 13, 2011 at 2:02 pm
  10. David Harris #

    Nothing wrong with your sentiments, Amanda, but a drug smuggler convicted in China will be executed. That is no more or less than a statement of fact.

    If someone plays Russian roulette and ends up dead, reactions are not particularly sympathetic (as a rule). There’s no real difference between Russian roulette and the Chinese variety.

    December 13, 2011 at 2:09 pm
  11. fraud #

    Very well said! I never thought of it that way…

    December 13, 2011 at 2:17 pm
  12. graham #

    As someone in recovery and now a substance abuse counselor,we teach addicts to take responsibility for their actions and to be conscious of the rule of law.one is subjected to the laws of the country that you enter.I feel so sad that this girl had no recourse to an appeal since she claimed her innocence.let us now not play GOD and preach condemnation,cos it is sad the way she was executed in a strange land with so much odds against her.thinking of her family#not self righteous

    December 13, 2011 at 3:18 pm
  13. isabella vd Westhuizen #

    She did not deserve to be put down like a dog.
    That is wrong.

    December 13, 2011 at 7:33 pm
  14. Rod of Sydney #

    My concern is that she may have been innocent. I travel extensively and have a nagging concern about the integrity of my luggage. If you are enough of a psychopath to deal drugs (sowing mayhem, death, despair and social disintegration) you will have no problem risking the life of an unsuspecting fellow traveler by hiding drugs in their luggage.

    I have absolutely no sympathy for those who deal. They are the same as paedophiles. Inconsiderate, robbers of innocence, promoters of distorted moral compasses. Life with no parole and confiscation of all worldly goods.

    NBNBNB: Anyone knowingly living off or receiving gifts from drug dealers is just as bad. The incentive is often that the dealer is the model of economic success in a poor region and heir conduct is encouraged by the accessories to this equivalency to paedophilia that hang out with them and so encourage/reward their behaviour. 5 years minimum for them.

    Users who can’t manage themselves and are a risk of influencing others should be institutionalised in a safe work farm. There is hope there, but let’s have no illusions. Take adult decisions, take adult consequences.

    December 13, 2011 at 10:16 pm
  15. possum #

    Please remember that China had a huge opium problem where 30% of the population were hopelessly addicted. The government had to crack down and hard, and they did this by executing anyone caught with even small amounts. Problem solved.

    Life is hard and we all have to make choices, work every day in a crap job or take a chance, take a package in your suitcase and you either get the big easy bucks or jail or lethal injection. Sorry for you if you make the wrong choice.

    December 14, 2011 at 9:17 am
  16. Jean Wright #

    @Cathy Raats. Agreed. Legalise all drugs, but not in order to cut Law Enforcement costs, but to cut off the vast profits made by dealers. There would then be little point in dealing. Let the State provide drugs to users, and then if done properly, they can be monitored and encourage to quit the habit. I believe Australia is doing something of this sort… It might also stop the ‘romantic’ notion that because it is forbidden its worth trying. And it might stop being ‘cool’ for youngsters – like cigarette smoking is now considered very ‘un-cool’ by many young people…. might work?

    It is really sad that anyone should get co-opted into this life destroying and criminalising habit and it is insane to suppose that if the Law of a country vigorously forbids drugs or drink with dire penalities for contravention of its Laws, then either don’t visit the country or obey its rules.

    December 14, 2011 at 9:27 am
  17. InternAfrica #

    I wonder if this was Mrs Cwele if the government would have done all they can…?

    December 14, 2011 at 10:25 am
  18. Drugs are only a problem because of their illegality. Were they legal the trade could be regulated; users would receive consistent quality and dosages. The huge profits made by the black marketeers would disappear. There is absolutely no logically or morally consistent reason why alcohol and tobacco should be legal and other drugs illegal. During prohibition in the US alcohol consumption increased, and the quality of the alcohol sold decreased, leading to health problems; and the mafia and other organised crime syndicates made windfall profits. The so-called “war on drugs” is a failure and it is high time we recognised that.

    Give us drugs not thugs.

    December 14, 2011 at 10:29 am
  19. Daemos one #

    Sorry Amanda, but this woman ultimately took the decision to put her life at risk and she paid the ultimate price. The illegal drug trade ruins and ends lives, Linden became a willing participant, nobody can ever be forced into doing anything they don’t want to do. She chose the life of a criminal and died a criminal’s death. Whether we believe China are correct in their enforcement of the death penalty is a non-issue. Would you have written this column if she had been imprisoned for life instead of put to death?

    Or would you have joined the chorus of voices saying that she got what she deserved.
    Addiction and China’s attitude towards smuggling is part of the wider issue, but the main point here is that she commited an illegal act and was appropriately punished in terms of the law of the country she was in, simple.

    December 14, 2011 at 10:41 am
  20. Benny #

    @ Chantelle

    If drugs were decriminalized your friend would have had a much better chance to seek help and would probably still be alive. Also, if she was so desperate that she was selling herself then it’s probably only “luck” that stopped her from meeting a man with a suitcase he wanted transported. The Chinese could easily have been the cause of your friend’s death. Mules are desperate people.
    I’ve seen the drug dealers on street corners too but I doubt the killing a few of them would be enough to stop them. Drug dealers getting killed is a daily occurrence but it doesn’t seem to stop them. Why would the law hanging a few dealers send a message that their rival’s bullets does not?

    December 14, 2011 at 10:47 am
  21. myth #

    It’s the law in China; bleat as much as you like in SA. Besides, it’s hypocritical to accuse others of being hypocrites, after all nobody is perfect.

    But don’t do the crime etc.

    Innocent of the charges? Who knows but the judges decided not so your fight is with them.

    December 14, 2011 at 10:53 am
  22. GarethV #

    We can sit around and pass judgement all we like, but the facts remain: A person was caught smuggling drugs in China, and therefore under Chinese law, she was executed.
    Personally I condemn any person who knowingly puts the lives of other people at risk, and that’s exactly what drug smugglers do by ferrying potentially life threatening substances around the world.
    Whether right or wrong, China had the final say, so are we now going to pass judgement over a country, because its laws differ from ours?
    South African’s love to pass judgement though, which is why we are in the social mess we find ourselves in.

    December 14, 2011 at 11:08 am
  23. GarethV #

    isabella vd Westhuizen, surely its better than a firing squad, an alternative method in China.
    SA needs to get equally tough on foreign criminals…ie: Asians who kill Rhinos for their own medicinal plaeasure.

    December 14, 2011 at 11:13 am
  24. MLH #

    Surely it all boils down to whether she knew the package was in her luggage or not? And how can we tell? I believe it is not our place to judge her or her captors; however, it seems strange to me that anyone should say she should have been tried in SA (where we no longer give the death sentence). Does the writer then believe that Shrien Dewani should automatically be tried in the UK? (It would make no difference to me, although I do believe he should be tried if his guilt is supposed).

    December 14, 2011 at 11:29 am
  25. Mark Schulz #

    Maybe drugs should be legal, I think that Carl Sagan, Milton Friedman and Thomas Sowell provide excellent arguments, the latter two from the conservative view as to why this should be the case. Governments should not have the power to regulate what we do to our own bodies so long as it doesn’t cause tangible harm to others. I think that people should be free to kill themselves with drugs if they see fit, but must be punished if they commit a crime in pursuit of a fix. There is no real difference between someone robbing a house for a TV or robbing a house for a shot of tik, yet people place such emphasis on ‘drug related’ crime.

    However, having said what should be, the reality at this point in time is that if you are caught smuggling drugs into China you are going to be executed. People can’t sit around and um and ah about some ideal state, or think that the reality will change over night. You don’t have the power to bring this woman back from the dead, neither do you have the power or right to change China’s laws. The only thing that can be changed is South Africans’ behavior – don’t smuggle drugs, the choice is yours.

    December 14, 2011 at 3:01 pm
  26. Trish #

    At least the Chinese are catching and convicting drug smugglers/peddlers/mules whether they’re voluntarily doing it or not. In South Africa everybody seems to know where to find your friendly local drug pusher except the police?

    December 14, 2011 at 3:06 pm
  27. BillyC #

    @Amanda: I think most people miss your most important point. 15% of people in any normal human population are potential addicts. I dare say this does not exclude moslem and strict theocracies, where dark nasty habits are driven well underground and tend to blow up unexpectedly.

    The US has sponsored a war on drugs that has been as spectacular a failure as its war on terror. 50000 Mexicans have been killed – many in the cross fire- to protect the US from its fix. Most of us lost count in countries like Bolivia…… and the war in Afganistan is as much about its poppy fields as its Taliban

    Thanks for the best argued article on this emotive issue I’ve seen in a while

    December 14, 2011 at 3:45 pm
  28. monica #

    For all we know she may have been innocent however lets face facts…u don’t mess with the chinese…if there r things they don’t play with its their traditions and laws….whether you as south africans will be upset,…disgusted…or whatever you want to feel, the fact is drug smuggling in certain countries is punishable by death…and if u think that will change because u r trading partners then you are truly delussional.

    December 14, 2011 at 4:30 pm
  29. Palaboran #

    So why did she fly to China? Was it to have a cultural vacation, perhaps to open a business where labour is cheap and pliable, or maybe an import/export business opportunity? Would not smuggling drugs into China be a more likely reason?

    December 14, 2011 at 7:16 pm
  30. Oldfox #

    Malaysia and Singapore also had mandatory death sentences for drug trafficking. Three cases have made the Malaysians reconsider. In one of these cases, the Malaysian govt. Successfully persuaded the Chinese govt to change a death sentence to life imprisonment, for a young Malaysian girl.

    December 14, 2011 at 7:37 pm
  31. We have all this concern about South African drug mules smuggling drugs OUT of this country. Should our concern not be also for how the drugs get INTO the country in the first place? Bad policing? No more specialised drug unit? Bribed police and customns officials?

    Often the mules who are caught are as a result of the drug dealers tipping off bribed policemen so that the police can show some arrests for their record.

    This latest one in Thailand is going to have difficulty claiming someone slipped drugs into her luggage when it was found in her hair.

    December 14, 2011 at 7:46 pm
  32. Sas Kloppers #

    Amanda

    You may be a journalist but you are nothing else, bar bloody ignorant.

    I’ve spent years with addicts and agree with those who feel Janice got what she deserved.

    Your statement that drug mules are usually women are also untrue. Go read the USA DEA statistics and you’ll find that the percentage of mules that are male is in the high sixties.

    Consider this. 3Kg Meth translate to 3000 grams. That’s 3000 people that will rob, steal, harm and murder for the next hit. Calculate the damage done to society by these 3000 criminals before you get on your silly soapbox.

    In a world where there’s 51 million hardcore Meth addicts it’s time for drastic measures.

    What would you prefer? A single hospital spending $300m per annum in it’s burn unit alone trying to save the lives of burn victims of Meth lab explosions, or spending the same funds on the poor, homeless and orphans?

    I know what I’d chose.

    Leave them to rot in public. Kill the traffickers and the druglords, in broad daylight and in full view of everyone. Leave their scum corpses to rot in the sun. Seeing something like that’ll be a good answer to the person who considers using a prohibited, criminally damaging substance out of socalled curiosity.

    You are well and truly a misguided, ignorant fool…..

    December 14, 2011 at 9:00 pm
  33. Jacq #

    Mrs Sevsti, your comments are condesending and extremely one-eyed. Without expressing a view if the penalty Linden got was justified or not ~ she broke a law in a country that has always stated you will be put to death for breaking this law. Now, if your argument holds, anybody can commit any crime anywhere in the world, because in their personal opinion it is “ok”? Just throw away the law books! You also miss the point with your reference to drug cartels ~ the court was not trying to punish them, they were simply applying the law to the indivdual that was transgressing that law. Period. Final comment ~ 99% of people involved with drug trading do it because it is fast money. They take their chances making money by breaking laws. I have little simpanthy for them. That said, Linden’s case is a sad story for the young women and her family.

    December 14, 2011 at 11:59 pm
  34. why should we respect a countries law just because it’s their law- the death penalty for drug smuggling is excessive, no matter what

    December 15, 2011 at 1:47 am
  35. GW #

    Wow, I had no idea this horse was so high for most. I am staggered by those who think that she deserved what she got because it is Chinese law, because she was peddling “illegal” substances and all the other rot that people have in their uninformed, virgin, empty heads.

    There are multiple ways in which this woman could have been a victim here. She may have had the stuff slipped into her baggage without her knowledge. Crime syndicate kidnaps a family member and tells you to take 3kg of drugs into China or you never see them again. Friend, boyfriend of husband asks you to deliver a parcel which you trustingly do. Yet all the lousy little pseudo legal experts who have never lived a day of real life in a real trench sit here and condemn this woman to death because she should have “known better”.
    I would, in all honesty, have preferred some of you to take her place for your crime is worse than hers. You are a lynch mob, morally corrupt to your core without even knowing it, the most dangerous type of animals. You down your beer and shake your head about those who use drugs, light up your cigarette which is more adictive than herione and shake your head about those who sniff down a line. You have all the answers but you have never even been to the other side and walked a mile in other shoes yet you are so sure.

    Take it from someone who has, you have no clue and your judgemental prose is a digital trail of what is truly wrong with humanity in its state of massive…

    December 15, 2011 at 8:58 am
  36. Daemos one #

    Personally I think I would notice if my suitcase was 3kg heaver, just saying

    December 15, 2011 at 9:17 am
  37. Billy C

    There is a very good novel, the name of which I now forget, that deals with a Cape Town Muslim woman who got addicted to gambling, which is another addiction.

    But more important is that 85 percent of the population are NOT addictive personalities, and so could give up alcohol, which is out of the system in 3 days, but don”t. Drugs are different, much more addictive, and some cause permanent brain damage.

    The human race has always used mood enhancers – from the Bushmen trances induced by herbs and rhythmic dancing, to the Sufis who also use dancing, to the American Indians and their mushrooms and tobacco.

    Many of Africa’s Muslims are addicted to chewing betel leaves.

    December 15, 2011 at 9:34 am
  38. We actually cannot stop other countries from enforcing their laws on our citizens. We couldn’t stop Botswana from executing a South African woman, let alone stopping China. If we don’t like the laws, we can protest against them. But, frankly, China’s drug laws are not exactly the biggest human rights problem in China. And it’s not as if our own anti-drug campaigns have been a brilliant success.

    The people on this thread speaking in favour of legalisation have got it right. Personally I feel that recreational drugs should be available from state-run pharmacies, medically overseen and with a clear understanding of the risks. Like providing condoms to prisoners.

    Mark you, a lot of my cronies can’t get out of bed in the morning without a snort, a swig or a spliff. And without drug mules, who would get the stuff across the border and up their noses?

    December 15, 2011 at 10:37 am
  39. I suspect that like with most things there are many ways of looking at it.

    Was she guilty? Well a justice system found her guilty and not having the information they have I can’t comment. I suspect that the Chinese have a functioning criminal justice system.

    Are anti drug dealing laws, anti rhino poaching laws justified? are there better ways to deal with these problems? again a matter of debate.

    Was she influenced into becoming a drug mule? Can we blame the men in her life? I suppose unfortunately in some cases yes. We do still have huge problems in paternalism.

    Was its stupid to take the risk – undoubtedly but then people do take these risks – on a different level we see the stupidity of gambling all the time, in the casino and on the lotto (sometimes called a tax on stupidity)

    The one thing that we should all be united on is the Death Penalty it is a barbaric sentence, for many many reasons no one and no state should have the power to take a life for any reason. It is also no deterrent.

    So – should this woman have been executed? There no way should she have. For the rest there are consequences for the choices we all make – many are not fair and many of the laws we live under are ridiculous (in my opinion) so become activists and change them.

    Amanda – have a lovely holiday season.

    December 15, 2011 at 10:37 am
  40. B Derrick Radebe #

    China is one country that practices zero tolerance to crime.If China is capable of executing four senior Chinese Executives for fraud , it stands to reason that it will not hesitate to do likewise to drug mules from elsewhere.Methinks it is going overboard to roundly condemn the S A government for failing to stop the execution when we all know that it is outside of it`s capacity to dictate to a powerful sovereign country which has it`s own laws.Equal treatment dictates that if Chinese nationals are executed for various crimes falling within the execution category it would be unjust to let foreigners off the hook because of interventions by their national politicians.

    December 15, 2011 at 6:03 pm
  41. Nguni #

    Typically lazy journalism -opinionated regarding the sentence but not lifting a finger to get the story behind the story:
    What was she doing in China if not drug smuggling?
    Where was the tik produced?
    Signs of luggage tampering?
    Her contacts in China?
    etc etc..
    Are we not too critical of the chinese justice system because of shortcomings in the SA one? Yes, they are not democrats (just look at the sneaky way they put her to death) but does that rule out justice?

    December 15, 2011 at 9:35 pm
  42. Brian #

    Hi Amanda,
    Let me immediately saddle up.
    Is it a good idea to travel to a country laden with narcotics knowing full that death penalties apply for drug trafficking?
    Do all people who endure the agony of their own addiction or of loved ones all believe that the solution is to decriminalise drug abuse and give the pushers an ever increasing easy market ?
    Alcohol and tobacco are legal and generate huge taxes. Should various forms of light medium and hardline drugs be legalised? Imagine the advantages of the extra revenue? (It could prove fairly tricky to collect the taxes!)
    Are Mexico and Columbia shining examples of law and order?
    Demand certainly drives supply. Is it morally defensible to turn a blind eye to drug usage, knowing full well that it destroys lives and families, spreads crime violence and murder and grows the huge unjust riches of the perpetrators of what must certainly be considered a crime against humanity?
    Many drug mules are women caught in the multibillion dollar industry that capitulative decriminalisation of drug usage has spawned. Chances are they that they are also addicts and need to feed their habits, and that they are mothers. Why perpetuate their misery by allowing the drug trade to grow exponentially?
    Do countries with draconian anti drug laws have significant drug problems?
    Is it not time for so called caring countries to step up to the plate and act to outlaw drugs or are we at the stage where the world economy will sink if we do?

    December 17, 2011 at 5:23 pm
  43. In black culture, pre colonialism, men were executed for both murder and theft. If we have to have black culture forced on us, why only part of it?

    The death sentence was never debated at Codesa and is not in the constitution. The judges just high handedly decided that murderer’s rights to, were above victims rights.

    Of course they decided totally the other way around on Affirmative Action – where victims rights took priority over good governance, even if the victims were victims of tribalism not whites.

    The fact is that most of the original Constitutional Court judges were activists, not experienced judges.

    December 18, 2011 at 12:57 am
  44. Iain Dale #

    Perhaps Linden’s fate will not make a dent in the Mafia, Zeta and Triad bosses business but it may make more potential ‘mules’ think twice about carrying out such activities. Do we need these drugs to be brought into this country and killing how many of our citizens. And yes I agree alcohol kills numerous people on our roads in particular and as one of the respondants points out we have no commitment or desire to carry out the laws that are in place. More political will towards these crimes locally may mean we have a ‘voice’ to condemn other countries BUT they have laws in place, and however bararic they may seem to us at LEAST they have the will to fullfil the law.

    December 19, 2011 at 10:39 am
  45. MySon #

    @ Ly

    By your own posting, Shrien Dewani should be tried in England for a crime he committed in South Africa?

    What if whatever they consider a crime in China is not criminal in South Africa, like Googling the word Democracy?

    December 20, 2011 at 3:19 pm
  46. Dan #

    It’s actually a bit of a joke to claim methamphetamine has ravaged Cape Town, when the areas in which it is abused are the same places where people abuse alcohol are a wide scale. Fact is it is just a lot of drug abusers.

    If we’re going to ban things whereby someone might hurt themselves, then we might as well ban everything. I remain perplexed at the almost glee with which some people support the persecution of all drug users because a minority harm themselves.

    China does have widespread drug use. You can also be sure that the organised criminals involved in distribution have members of the authorities assisting them. And frankly 3kg of methamphetamine is such a pitifully small amount

    “Drugs are different, much more addictive, and some cause permanent brain damage.”
    Absolute, total and utter drivel. Where do people get this idiotic nonsense? Oh wait, they swallow, whole, the propaganda fed to them.

    December 20, 2011 at 4:06 pm
  47. Dan #

    “Consider this. 3Kg Meth translate to 3000 grams. That’s 3000 people that will rob, steal, harm and murder for the next hit. Calculate the damage done to society by these 3000 criminals before you get on your silly soapbox.”
    Probably not much. Seriously some people need to stop looking at the basket cases as representative. Do you think the drunk lying on the street corner is the typical alcohol user? Well that’s exactly what you’re doing with illegal drugs, holding up the wreck as the norm rather than what they are, one of the minority.

    “In a world where there’s 51 million hardcore Meth addicts it’s time for drastic measures.”
    Even assuming this 51 million figure is accurate (which I doubt) that’s a pretty small number of people really. I’d have to ask how this number was arrived at though, as well as how hardcore and addict were defined.

    “I’ve spent years with addicts”
    In other words you are not qualified to comment on drug use, legal or illegal, because you have no experience with a wide range of users.

    December 20, 2011 at 4:14 pm
  48. Dan #

    @Daemos one – make up your mind. If someone chooses to use any drug then they must accept the responsibility for any harm that comes to them. Drug sellers don’t force people to buy their products. So why should a drug abuser be considered some helpless victim?

    @GarethV – so why single out particular drugs? Every time someone sells a bicycle they are knowingly providing someone with something that could get them killed. I could give a very, very long list of other potentially life threatening activities that are perfectly legal. I presume you’d want them all outlawed.

    Why should South African’s not pass judgement? It’s exactly what we should do. Any mess comes from not attempting to right wrongs or speak out against evil. And drug prohibition is certainly the latter.

    December 20, 2011 at 4:26 pm
  49. wysiwyg #

    I am sure the chinese authorities would say the same of the south african justice system..get off your high horse of ” liberation before education” where criminals
    do not live in fear.Only the law abiding live in fear.
    Fear of rape,assault,battering,abuse,robbery,mugging,etc…

    December 20, 2011 at 6:44 pm

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  1. Haunts: They are neither mules nor witches. They are women. – women in and beyond the global - December 16, 2011

    [...] and despondent. South Africa, at least according to discussions in online forums and newspapers, is divided as to the execution. Many feel Linden deserved her fate. Why? She was a mule. She smuggled drugs into China. She should [...]

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